OOC chatter

[PhaedrusXY]

With our version psionic/ magic transparency, battlemagic perception would still pick up both powers and PLA's, right? Meaning I could counter both with Divine Defiance.

James, i forgot to mention this, but IIRC sign is a 1st level cleric spell in spell compendium, that give +4 to your next initiative roll, and lasts 10 minutes/level.

You can't counterspell psionic powers, nor can you counterspell with them, unless James is instituting that as a house rule. (Does that ability let you counter-spell SLAs, even though you normally can't? If so, I could see where you're coming from.)

[jameswilliamogle]

I'm not sure how counterspelling works with SLAs and PLAs.  I've always seen that they can be counterspelled in RL games.  That may/may not be RAW.

With this complete transparency version of magic/psionics, dispel psionics could dispel magic, and vice versa.

How do people feel about allowing PLAs/SLAs being able to be counterspelled, though?  I'm willing to defer to the majority.  Again, its tricky - I have a list of most of my monsters, already.  Some of them do have SLAs (how many, though, you'd have to guess on).

[PhaedrusXY]

The RAW of it is that you can't counterspell SLAs, PLAs, or psionic powers, nor can you counterspell with them. (Even with basic transparency, they can Dispel each other, though.) Being that I'm playing a psychic character, and am not planning on counterspelling, I'd of course prefer to keep it that way. I'm hardly unbiased, though. If other people would rather it be allowed, I won't be too upset or anything.

Edit: Hmm... maybe I'm wrong. This is from the Psionics FAQ, on the WotC boards:

Q:  Can you "counter-power" a psionic manifestation, just like counterspelling a spell?
A: In a word, no. You can't counter-power, nor can you counter a power with a spell or a spell with a power.
Do note that due to psionics-magic transparency, the spell Dispel Magic (which has a counterspell option in addition to its target/area choices) can be used to counter a psionic power by essentially negating its energies as it begins to manifest. This is not present in the Dispel Psionics power (which only has the target/area choice). This relies on a psionics-magic transparency interpretation, though, so not all DMs will allow it. Thankfully, countering is a rarely-used tactic, so this is unlikely to come up in a game situation.

Spell-like abilities explicitly state that they can't be countered, though, and psionic powers are considered Psi-like abilities (and hence Spell-like abilities in Transparency). So I'd have thought you couldn't counter them. Eh, either way, it shouldn't be a big deal, unless wezylithyx decides to take the rest of us out or something.

[Prak, the Mad]

I'm against countering psionics or S/PLAs purely for flavour reasons... it's inherent magic that comes directly from the body, so it doesn't make sense to me that it can just be shut down by mimicry, just like a barbarian's rage can't be shut down by screaming back at them, it takes specific magic, Dispel Magic in the case of SLAs, Calm Emotions in the case of a barbarian's rage. So, that's my druthers.

[wezylithyx]

Well, decide what you want with the powers and PLA's, though I would like to be able to counter them.

The main reason I brought this up is because Divine Defiance specifically mentions being able to counter spell-like-abilities.

[jameswilliamogle]

I'll wait for one more response, but it seems like Prak's is the only strong opinion on the matter.

Define Defiance, if it explicitly mentions countering SLAs, can still do so (this is a case of the specific overriding the general).

[Prak, the Mad]

yeah, I have no problem with a power that specifically says that it counters P/SLAs.

[wezylithyx]

Can someone double-check that for me?  Its in Fiendish Codex II, and I'm AFB. My laptop's getting fixed, and all my real books are back in North Carolina. I can always download it onto a friends computer, if need be.

[Kaelik]

1) I'm with those that say RAW is no counterspell, and it should be.

2) Divine Defiance does explicitly call out SLAs.

3) It seems from the wording that Divine Defiance doesn't actually use spell slots, which is pretty cool.

[wezylithyx]

y0, I'm looking for some feedback. I'm finishing up my character's details and spells before things really start happening, and I'm having a dilemma.

I feel short on turn attempts, I have 14 total currently (3+5 cha, +4 nightstick, +2 reliquary holy symbol) Allowing my to DMM chain 3x per day and use Divine Defiance a mere twice.

I currently have easy metamagic set to my reach spell feat, which i think will be handy in certain situations. Is it worth it, though? I could switch it over to Chain Spell, which would allow me to chain 4 spells per day for the same number of turn attempts. I could also switch out the feat altogether for Extra Turning, which would give me another 5 turning attempts (from the reliquary holy symbol).

I just had another thought, which is to lose one level of Church Inquisitor for a level of Contemplative (i think that's doable by this point...) and grab the planning domain, which will give me extend spell. I need one metamagic feat to take chain, which is why I took reach (plus they make a great combo), but with extend I could switch it out for Extra Turning. That would grant me 19 turn attempts a day, with easy metamagic set to chain spell I could chain 5 spells per day and have 4 turns left over for Divine Defiance.

Thoughts?

[PhaedrusXY]

I think taking a level of contemplative sounds good, but I'd leave your feats as-is. Reach + Chain is awesome. Chained Harm, anyone? Or Chained Heal? You could also think about getting a MM Rod for either. I don't know if there is a printed one, but Reach MM Rods should be fairly cheap, I'd think.

[jameswilliamogle]

I think taking a level of contemplative sounds good, but I'd leave your feats as-is. Reach + Chain is awesome. Chained Harm, anyone? Or Chained Heal? You could also think about getting a MM Rod for either. I don't know if there is a printed one, but Reach MM Rods should be fairly cheap, I'd think.

Heh, not in this city...
 

(j/k; one of you has teleport, I'm sure)

[jameswilliamogle]

ANYWAYS, has the paranoia died down?  Do you guys want to fight guards now, or go into Selectra's vagina death trap portal to the abyss, erm, business?

[jameswilliamogle]

also, is this right?

CURRENT:
Dragon ECL 11
Greth ECL 11
Baragos ECL 12
Adrian ECL 12
Hazael ECL 12
Prof K ECL 12

[Kaelik]

Can only confirm Dragon and Greth are ECL 11, most of the rest should be ECL 12.

[mans0011]

also, is this right?

CURRENT:
Dragon ECL 11
Greth ECL 11
Baragos ECL 12
Adrian ECL 12
Hazael ECL 12
Prof K ECL 12

Prof is going to have crafting XP taken away, but that shouldn't use up all 2k. Also, seeing as how I didn't really know and my sheet isn't complete, do you mind if I take out all of my Know Arc skills ranks (except 1) and put them into Concentration? On a positive note, I'm almost completely packed, already said goodbye to family (was down there this weekend...) and will be in Newport News, VA in exactly one week. Soon and very soon, K's shit will be 100% legit and ready to go. *shakes fist at the hustle and bustle of moving*

[jameswilliamogle]

I don't mind.  feel free to make the change.

[wezylithyx]

I'm ECL 12, but I have to figure out the XP i used crafting.

I could use the level of Contemplative to grab Undeath Domain for Extra Turning, but that's not very fitting flavor-wise. Anyone know any good place magic that grants metamagic or more turn attempts?  any other ways for more turns? and is place magic even allowed?

[PhaedrusXY]

A reliquary holy symbol grants another 2 turns to most clerics. It's only 1000 gp, and in the magic item compendium.

[PhaedrusXY]

The buffs mentioned in this post should be added to Greth's "active buffs" on his sheet.