Heroic Origins: Rules Discussion

[AfterCrescent]

The purpose of this thread is to keep out of game rules discussion/debates out of the Game Threads.

Should an issue with a rule come up, this will be the thread for discussing that ruling.

Houserules

• Banned Spells: Shun the Dark Chaos, Embrace the Dark Chaos, Wish, Shapechange, Celerity, Time Stop, Polymorph Any Object, Gate, Astral Projection
• Use Fractional BAB & Saves, as outlined in Unearthed Arcana
• Player's die at -10 or -Con, whichever is most beneficial at the time.
• Max HP for levels 1 & 2; average afterwards.
• Everyone gains Able learner or Open Minded as a bonus feat
  
  
• Disjunction exists. It does not destroy magic items; rather, it renders them inert and nonmagical for 1 hour.

[Prime32]

I have realised that since the changeling's shapechanging ability does not affect possessions, and Vow of Poverty won't let me buy outfits or props, my character is at a disadvantage when it comes to disguise. Could the restrictions on the Vow be waived for nonmagical clothing, my character be given an ability that changes his clothing, or a hat of disguise allowed?

[AfterCrescent]

I have realised that since the changeling's shapechanging ability does not affect possessions, and Vow of Poverty won't let me buy outfits or props, my character is at a disadvantage when it comes to disguise. Could the restrictions on the Vow be waived for nonmagical clothing, my character be given an ability that changes his clothing, or a hat of disguise allowed?

The hat is clearly a no.  I think the changeling ability should stay (although I'd listen to a counter argument) as is because they made it a point it does not affect clothing... I don't see the problem with havine a couple different sets of clothing, although none of them would be in nice condition, you must be aware. I'll limit it to 4 sets of clothing, not costing more than 2 gold each. So 4 sets of clothing for variation... How's that sound?

[Prime32]

I have realised that since the changeling's shapechanging ability does not affect possessions, and Vow of Poverty won't let me buy outfits or props, my character is at a disadvantage when it comes to disguise. Could the restrictions on the Vow be waived for nonmagical clothing, my character be given an ability that changes his clothing, or a hat of disguise allowed?

The hat is clearly a no.  I think the changeling ability should stay (although I'd listen to a counter argument) as is because they made it a point it does not affect clothing... I don't see the problem with havine a couple different sets of clothing, although none of them would be in nice condition, you must be aware. I'll limit it to 4 sets of clothing, not costing more than 2 gold each. So 4 sets of clothing for variation... How's that sound?

The problem arises when you want to impersonate a specific person. It would be simple enough for a normal character to copy their outfit, but I'm screwed without a seeming or veil spell (levels 5 and 6 respectively). You could always steal their clothes, but this would not work in every situation and would press "exalted" to breaking point. Also, a changeling without Vow of Poverty has a practically unbeatable disguise with a hat of disguise.

[AfterCrescent]

Disguise Self is a first level spell that can cover this specific person, no? Seems a simple answer to the issue. Touch. 10min/L. Good stuff, no?

[Prime32]

Disguise Self is a first level spell that can cover this specific person, no? Seems a simple answer to the issue. Touch. 10min/L. Good stuff, no?

*cough*

[AfterCrescent]

Are you not going arcane next level?

[EjoThims]

If nothing else I can always bluff, diplomacy, or beg for new sets of clothing for you to borrow. 

[Prime32]

Are you not going arcane next level?

Well, I wasn't... maybe I could take a level of sorcerer, but I want to get into warshaper early, so I can take ranks in Disguise and qualify for cabinet trickster. A sorcerer level would have to come later in the build, by which point the alternatives are available.

[AfterCrescent]

Ah, well the disguise skill can be used to mimic clothing of another person.

Would that work?

[Prime32]

Ah, well the disguise skill can be used to mimic clothing of another person.

Would that work?

'kay. Now, I want to ask if Ability Focus (Touch of Golden Ice) counts as an exalted feat, since it boosts an exalted ability. Likewise, can I apply the Virulent Poison (SS) feat to a ravage?

[AfterCrescent]

Now, I want to ask if Ability Focus (Touch of Golden Ice) counts as an exalted feat, since it boosts an exalted ability. Likewise, can I apply the Virulent Poison (SS) feat to a ravage?

I'm not sure about Ability Focus... I'll have to think on that one and get back to you. Is that your key reasoning, that it boosts an exalted feat so it should be exalted?

On the Virulent Poison feat, I have to say no because the requirement is to have one as an Ex Ability and Ravages are specifically Su in nature.

[Prime32]

Now, I want to ask if Ability Focus (Touch of Golden Ice) counts as an exalted feat, since it boosts an exalted ability. Likewise, can I apply the Virulent Poison (SS) feat to a ravage?

I'm not sure about Ability Focus... I'll have to think on that one and get back to you. Is that your key reasoning, that it boosts an exalted feat so it should be exalted?

Pretty much. Should I try justifying the Shape Soulmeld feat as an exalted feat while I'm at it? :wink
[spoiler]Soulmelds are tied to your alignment, so if you are good-aligned, your soulmelds are made out of good energy. This means that Shape Soulmeld is an inherently "good" feat for a good character. An exalted feat is an inherently good feat.[/spoiler]

[AfterCrescent]

I'm gonna nix the soulmelds. There's an inherent difference between good and exalted like there's a difference between LG fighters and LG paladins :wink

I'll get back to you on Ability Focus though It can only be taken once, and there really arent that many decent exalted feats... I'm okay with Ability Focus (Touch of Golden Ice) as an exalted feat.

[EjoThims]

I'd actually like to propose a modification to the Able Learner houserule.

Every character gets either Able Learner or Open Minded. This way multiclassers still get more extra skill ranks from Able Learner, but those of us taking pretty much solely skills that are class skills anyway get a bit of a boost as well.

[AfterCrescent]

I'll let the masses speak. Same as all the other houserules, if it gets 4 votes, it's in.

[Dictum Mortuum]

I've taken one in each monster identifying knowledge skill, and i plan investing in autohypnosis with Able Learner, but open minded is not bad at all. Actually that's a nice house rule. From now on i'll let my players choose between the two. I already give them monkey grip as a bonus feat
I'm in if we can choose between the two.

[DaveTheMagicWeasel]

Aye, I'll vote for that.

[BoSheck]

I'll vote for that.  I won't be changing though--it seems fair.

Hey, quick question:  I'm going to be dipping into Hierophant to get divine reach.  I can then use chain spell on my 'reach' spells, correct?  Otherwise I won't be taking the dip, which is fine.

[AfterCrescent]

I'll vote for that.  I won't be changing though--it seems fair.

That makes 4. It's settled

Hey, quick question:  I'm going to be dipping into Hierophant to get divine reach.  I can then use chain spell on my 'reach' spells, correct?  Otherwise I won't be taking the dip, which is fine.

I'm currently running on 48 hours awake without sleep, so I'm going to hold off on making any judgment calls, but I'm assuming this is a gray area since you're asking. Probably a safe bet to just go ahead and throw your reasoning up. I'll check it all out after I've slept