Author Topic: CO Diary: The Unoptimized  (Read 8025 times)

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ZeroSpace

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Re: CO Diary: The Unoptimized
« Reply #40 on: March 10, 2009, 09:31:37 PM »
Really, I think your red 'friend' there covers the doom nicely, Sinfire.
YAY! I get to go to the SPECIAL hell!

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CannibalSmith

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Re: CO Diary: The Unoptimized
« Reply #41 on: March 11, 2009, 07:24:10 AM »
More, more!

McPoyo

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Re: CO Diary: The Unoptimized
« Reply #42 on: March 15, 2009, 01:24:09 PM »
ZeroSpace, I don't think it's the hydra they wouldn't like, but the initial ambush encounter, as it stands right now. I ran something very similar involving four basic DMG goblins earlier, and they nearly lost a character even to that.

[spoiler=And so the party reaches Blasingdell]So, this last session, they leveled up to level 4, bought more gear/commissioned and received magic items from the town of Blasingdell, since it had an economy that could hope to provide supply for the gear they were looking for. They have identified and put to use, or traded, everything magical they pulled from the Citadel except for Shatterspike. They know the name of the weapon, but they really have no idea what the item really does, IC or OOC. They think it just gives bonuses to sundering, and bypasses hardness. This should be fun over the next couple sessions, since that is why they are holding onto the weapon in the first place.

The psion's player couldn't make this session, due to a calculus test he had to take during our time slot, which I didn't learn of until about an hour before the session. So his character is being NPC'd through combats by a corporate effort to dictate his combat actions based on what the group has seen of his combat tactics thus far. It worked really well, and is probably the only player who behaves remotely predictably in combat.[/spoiler]

[spoiler=Expedition to Kundarak]They set out for Kundarak, and had only minor encounters through the forest to the stronghold. The ranger noticed the tracks from the orc scouting party, and the players decided to track down and see what the tracks might have meant. They fought some wolverines (Still insisting on the DMG's random encounter tables), and some other fight that they destroyed through epic rolls before the enemies even got to act (Even the cleric, with her -6 to initiative, went before the enemies). However, they failed to catch up to either patrol before they were returned to Kundarak.[/spoiler]

[spoiler=And battle is joined!]The ranger, sitting in point position through the wilds instead of the rogue who was bringing up the rear this time, noticed the two orc sentries about the same time the orcs heard the cleric trouncing along in her magical full-plate. Initiative was rolled as the party wanted to attack immediately, but the players rolled abysmally (This was more or less the theme of the night, the PCs only rolled super spectacularly when it was for something uninteresting and relatively unimportant). The orcs acted first, and ran off to alert the other guards within the stronghold. Since none of the PCs spoke orc, they didn't know what they were saying/yelling, and waited for 3 rounds on the side of the mountain for a horde of orcs to come boiling out or something. I'm not sure what the players were attempting to do, since they couldn't figure it out themselves. Finally creeping forward, they dealt with getting peppered with arrows as they climbed the stairs to the entrance (only 1 hit, and it was for 1 damage). However, by the time they got within sight of the door, the orc was just finishing closing and barring the door.

DM's Note: I really liked the sidebar detailing a round-by-round breakdown of how the fortress mobilized against defenders. It really saved me the work of counting out squares and figuring it out for myself. More modules should do this.[/spoiler]

[spoiler=And they break-in!]
After three rounds with both the rogue and ranger attempting to force the door open (Each have a +3 str), the cleric got fed up, burned her Strength domain power, and had both rogue and ranger assist forcing the door inwards. They beat the dc 25 by 2 points, and forced in the door with it's locking bar open, only to find the rope bridge cut and dangling from their end of the ravine, and the orcs already lined up behind the pillars across the way ready to pepper them with arrows.[/spoiler]

[spoiler=And thus begins the 4.5 minute standoff, wherein the PCs are sent running]
So, for the next 47 rounds, the PCs traded fire with the Orcs. The orcs had improved cover from the pillars (I had ruled the 9/10's of 3.0 cover was classified as 3.5's Improved Cover) and the PCs were just standing in that 10x10 entryway at the doors. The rogue fell to prone for the AC and attack bonus and started firing off bolts from her Heavy crossbow as quickly as she could (which was still 1 every 2 rounds, since she didn't have rapid reload) she could hit with at least a 15 on the die-roll, the Cleric pulled her light crossbow and started firing off shots (which were seriously ineffective, since she could only hit on a natural 20 with her ranged attacks), the ranger started plying his longbow, but since his AC was the lowest of the group's (and he considers himself to be the "Frontman" in combat. At least he now has more HP than the psion), he was standing instead of crouching/laying down, and he kept shouting orders for engagement, the orcs focused their fire upon him as the easiest and most obvious target. The psion was seriously hampered in what he could accomplish. All of his offensive powers outside of Entangling Ectoplasm either had a Close range (which didn't even clear the ravine, much less the extra 15 feet passed the ravine where the orcs were standing, or allowed a reflex saving throw, which they had no problems succeeding against with their cover bonuses, and even when they failed only took half damage. After burning through power points attempting to assist the party or kill enemies, he fell back to his light crossbow for 4 rounds, before deciding he was ineffective in this engagement (he only hit on a natural 20, as well), and bowed back out of the line of fire with 4 bolts left in reserve, in case they were needed later. The cleric was only able to get off a shot every other round or so, since she was constantly pushing healing spells into the ranger who took several critical hits throughout this engagement from the orc longbows, before she ran out of spells, realized CLW spells from a wand would be useless, handed off her faster firing crossbow to the rogue, and took up a position of cover in front of the ranger with her heavy armor and heavy shield, both magical. The orcs didn't manage to land a single 20 on her the rest of the fight, and she made out relatively unscathed, surviving at 1/2 hp. The ranger made out of the fight with 2 HP left. The orcs turned their attention to the rogue after seeing the equal futility of firing upon the cleric or ranger, and she made a hasty retreat after several rounds of weak damage which rapidly added up against her. The party withdrew, resources exhausted, ammunition dangerously low, without even setting foot into room 3, run off by cr 1/2 orcs at level 4.[/spoiler]

[spoiler=Running like Ninnies]
And so, the party was sent running by the orcs. On the bright side, they killed off 8 or the initial 11 orcs listed in the module who would respond to a breach of the front gate, the 4 orcs in the gallery overlooking the entryway never had to leave their hiding place, and the 8 orcs from the patrols that made it back inside the fortress never even engaged in combat. Well under the 1/2 required to prevent the rebuilding of the bridge, and more than enough left to adequately defend the fortress when the PCs return. 47 rounds to kill 8 orcs is pretty bad, and I'm wondering whether the PCs can even force their way back inside now that the orcs are expecting another incursion. They retreated into the forest, well off the path, through the 6 inch snow, without even bothering to attempt to hide their tracks. And so, I started in on the random encounter chance tables once again. You'd think they wouldn't expect me to roll these things after a fight like that :roll:.

And so they get not one, but two encounters. 4 orcs, which are rapidly dispatched by the ranger through pounce and whirling rage, and then the encounter which possibly could have killed 2 of the 4 pcs. A Dire Wolverine. The ranger happened to hear the creature, then failed his stealth checks to sneak up on the thing, and provoked it into a fight. Did he bother to alert the other PCs? In a fashion...[/spoiler]

[spoiler="OH GOD A DIRE WOLVERINE!"]
The party was woken by the ranger running full speed from the dense woods, through the middle of the clearing they were camped within, and out the other side screaming "OH GOD A DIRE WOLVERINE!"

Initiative was rolled, the psion went first, and hauled ass into the surrounding cover, since he had no powerpoints left, and was hoping not to have to engage the creature if the ranger could lead it away and get killed somewhere far off by it. He doesn't exactly like the ranger's "interesting" battle tactics and engagements. At all.

The rogue just played dead, and successfully bluffed the wolverine by a margin of 20+ when it came crashing into the clearing. Only amazing roll the rogue made this entire session, tbqh. The cleric drew the attention of the dire wolverine and ended up running off through the woods, sans armor because she had been asleep at the time, managing to stay barely ahead of the creature. The ranger, meanwhile, had climbed up into a tree, saw the cleric running off, and attempted to pull an Indiana Jones/Tarzan type maneuver by swinging across the gap, failed, and didn't die from falling damage thanks to his Boots of Landing. He apparently had been anticipating pulling a maneuver like that when they were back in Blasingdell where he bought them. Since his movement speed was 40, thanks to a "regional" feat he had taken at level 1, he slowly managed to gain on the fleeing cleric and dire wolverine. Deciding he'd rather attempt to kite the enraged beast since he had higher speed than engage it in melee, he pulled his bow, and managed to hit the creature on his second try. He managed to slowly pull away on his hasty retreat, and we ended the session with the player stating his intent to use his Knowledge (Geography) to make towards a river he could attempt to lose his scent in, before circling back to the party, in case the Dire Wolverine attempted to track him with its Scent special quality after the rage wore out. This entire encounter took 7 minutes to run, all said and done.[/spoiler]

[spoiler=Analysis]
The party is woefully unprepared for RHoD. This module is designed for a party of 3rd level characters, advancing to around 5th. Their first encounter in this module took over 4 minutes, and resulted in them running. Granted, it was slightly stacked against them because of the way they entered into the fight, but if they intend to try again, the fight is only going to be harder this next time. Looking through the rest of the module, I'm fairly certain the dragon will result in a TPK, and several of the "mini-boss" fights might result in a dead character or two, despite the CR for the fights being on-par or -1 compared to the party's level. Iirc, they should be almost level 5 right now, in terms of experience. I'm seriously contemplating ditching the plan to run the RHoD, I guess we'll see when they get closer to completing this module. As of right now, I know I could grant them standard WBL + %50, and grant them equal level to the CR of the Aspect of Tiamat and let them know what they were fighting, and they would still stand a really good chance of TPK, and have at least one, if not two, PC deaths. We shall see, I suppose.[/spoiler]

Edit: There was a fight with a Winter Wolf somewhere in there as a random encounter, too.
« Last Edit: March 15, 2009, 09:06:02 PM by McPoyo »
[Spoiler]
A gygaxian dungeon is like the world's most messed up game show.

Behind door number one: INSTANT DEATH!
Behind door number 2: A magic crown!
Behind door number 3: 4d6 giant bees, and THREE HUNDRED POUNDS OF HONEY!
They don't/haven't, was the point. 3.5 is as dead as people not liking nice tits.

Sometimes, their tits (3.5) get enhancements (houserules), but that doesn't mean people don't like nice tits.

Though sometimes, the surgeon (DM) botches them pretty bad...
Best metaphor I have seen in a long time.  I give you much fu.
Three Errata for the Mage-kings under the sky,
Seven for the Barbarian-lords in their halls of stone,
Nine for Mortal Monks doomed to die,
One for the Wizard on his dark throne
In the Land of Charop where the Shadows lie.
[/spoiler]

BowenSilverclaw

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Re: CO Diary: The Unoptimized
« Reply #43 on: March 16, 2009, 07:56:10 AM »
Hehe, I can't wait to see these guys flailing around in the RHoD, I guess I'm evil like that :P


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You caught a fish.  It was awesome.   :lol

McPoyo

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Re: CO Diary: The Unoptimized
« Reply #44 on: March 16, 2009, 12:11:31 PM »
To tell the truth, so am I :)
[Spoiler]
A gygaxian dungeon is like the world's most messed up game show.

Behind door number one: INSTANT DEATH!
Behind door number 2: A magic crown!
Behind door number 3: 4d6 giant bees, and THREE HUNDRED POUNDS OF HONEY!
They don't/haven't, was the point. 3.5 is as dead as people not liking nice tits.

Sometimes, their tits (3.5) get enhancements (houserules), but that doesn't mean people don't like nice tits.

Though sometimes, the surgeon (DM) botches them pretty bad...
Best metaphor I have seen in a long time.  I give you much fu.
Three Errata for the Mage-kings under the sky,
Seven for the Barbarian-lords in their halls of stone,
Nine for Mortal Monks doomed to die,
One for the Wizard on his dark throne
In the Land of Charop where the Shadows lie.
[/spoiler]

Khorus

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Re: CO Diary: The Unoptimized
« Reply #45 on: March 17, 2009, 05:34:53 PM »
lol, we played world's largest dungeon and it ended up like this lol. We were doing really really well just kicking in doors and slaughtering everything. This worked fine till we found some flying devil dire fiendish something or others. We were 4 lvl 1's minus a cleric. (at this point the dm was maxing the encounters trying to teach caution I guess.) The lvl 1 barbarian saved the day and ended up trying to stabilize the rest of the group. Next horrible encounter was the Dire Rat Sorc (no idea what the cr was) So it became pathetic quickly. We only had 1 silver dagger that we found. Barb took a lighting bolt to the face (we are all lvl 1 still) managed to live some how, raged and hugged the caster while everyone took turns stabing him.  Sorc died right b4 the rage would of ended. So everyone in the group had maybe 1-2 hps left and then a owlbear wades thru a red portal. This made the dm giggle. We pulled together shot the owlbear with a wand of color spray, tripped him, beat his head in b4 he could stand up. Shortly after this session we never played again. Seems to be the trend when dnd starts up among my friends 1 game or maybe 4-5 in a month then 6month dry stretch.

McPoyo

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Re: CO Diary: The Unoptimized
« Reply #46 on: March 28, 2009, 03:39:59 PM »
So, the party TPK'd.

Technically, it wasn't a TPK, but seeing as how the rogue barely escaped, and eventually contracted a lycanthropic curse off the fight, I figure that counts.

But I'm getting ahead of myself here, let's start where I last left off.

[spoiler=Round Two! Fight!]
After escaping the dire wolverine, the party met back up, healed, rested, then decided to try for the entryway into Kundarak again. However, since the cleric still had a negative to move silently from her armor, and she didn't stay far enough back, the orcs heard her as the party tried approaching to take them by surprise again. Ready for the PCs to attack again, and better prepared, the orcs waited for the party to once again breach the door (only taking slightly longer this time, since the PCs had worked out this assault plan already, and only suffered from some bad rolls for the first two attempts to blow in the door), then unloaded on the party with attacks from their longbows.[/spoiler]

[spoiler=Wherein the DM apologizes for making a mistake]
So, I mentioned to the PCs and apologized for running cover wrong. Turns out after I went back and looked it up, I had been shortchanging the orcs by quite a bit on the stats for Improved Cover. The PCs realized that perhaps they weren't built to assault this place when they started factoring the differences on AC and reflex saves. After 9 rounds of combat, the PCs move to withdraw, since even with a dedicated plan they still didn't have enough light on the other side of the room to effectively fight the orcs, and just weren't good enough shots to pick them off from around the pillars. Seems a fireball might have been handy here, but no wizard, and the rogue only had one rank in UMD, so the party didn't think it useful to get ahold of a wand or scroll to attempt to use it in combat. Oh well. The PCs tactically withdraw, covering themselves, and suffer fairly minorly on the way out, mostly expending just some divine spells and power points.[/spoiler]

[spoiler=OH GOD DROP BEARS WTF!]
So, random roll ends up with a Werebear on their last day to Blasingdell as an encounter. The party is literally at full power, loaded for bear (figuratively, as you'll come to see), and were ready for him. So when a bear "fell" from a tree along their path, they immediately decided to open up on the dude, without any other questions. I didn't even get to finish the sentence of "A bear falls out of a -" when they interrupted with "WE ATTACK" and started rolling initiative, and charged.

Bear wins init, and opens up on the Ranger. Ranger, despite taking almost approximately 2/5ths of his HP out of the two attacks that hit, managed to make the check to prevent getting grappled. His roll and mine could not have been more diametrically opposed. He took this as a sign of some sort. The ranger dealt 1 damage to the thing, because no one in the party had a silvered weapon. In fact, the ones they had found as loot they had pawned off instead. I guess they figured wererats were no big deal, a werebear wouldn't be a big deal either. This is where that "You really need to do more than 1dx+random-small-number of damage on your attacks, guys. This is kind of sad in terms of your damage output" lesson I've been trying to teach them came back and bit them in the butt. Hard.

Rogue dealt halfway decent damage via sneak attack flanking, and by halfway decent, I mean 9 hp total real damage. Cleric did no damage at all. After realizing that the DR might not allow them to survive this, they started moving back and attempting to maneuver around the thing to attempt to outrun it. I'd like to take this time to point out that left the warforged completely unguarded, and with nothing in the way to prevent the werebear from charging him down when it got lit up. The warforged realized this as he named off his damage roll, realized he dealt almost half it's HP in damage, and then was promptly charged. The party made AoO's, but dealt no damage in the process, the rogue currently laying on the ground at -2, the ranger capable of dealing 1 damage only on a maximum damage roll, and the cleric rolling nothing but mid damage numbers that didn't penetrate DR.

The bear clawed the warforged solidly, power attacking for 2 in the process thanks to the +2 from charging. He hit. It hurt. The warforged defensively manifested once more, dealing fairly minor damage, but bringing the enemy lycanthrope down to 21 HP, around the neighborhood of 1/3 left. He stepped back with a five foot step, not wanting to provoke an AoO, but not wanting to waste a round not dealing damage when he might be the only one capable of killing the creature, trusting in his companions to save him. He was already outside of Close Wounds range to begin with, I might add.

The cleric burned a cure moderate on the rogue, healing her nearly up to full thanks to her augment healing feat, the healing domain, and a near perfect roll on the dice. This left the Ranger to attempt to stop the "killing machine" from mowing down the warforged. You can imagine how that one went.[/spoiler]

[spoiler=Dead robotmen, and the near complete TPK]
The Ranger's attacks were largely uneffective, even with pouncing letting him make a full attack. The bear opened up on the warforged and took him to -13 with the first two attacks, his bite dropping the ranger with a max damage roll and the +3 from power attack to -1. The ranger really regretted only having an 18 AC, and that was while in whirling rage. The cleric and rogue, being the only two left, quickly decided a strategy. The rogue would run, and the cleric would die, since the cleric had no hope of outrunning the faster moving bear, and the rogue might make it if she had enough of a headstart.

The cleric charged the werebear, dealt 1 damage, and then promptly died to a horrific mauling. The rogue "escaped". Staggering back into town, barely alive, she collapsed into unconsciousness, unbeknownst to her, having contracted lycanthropy from the werebear's bite. The ranger finally pieced together the DR, with the "unnatural intelligence" gleaming in the bear's eyes as a werebear and broke down into hysterical laughter.[/spoiler]

[spoiler=And thus begins, the new beginning...maybe]
So, I decided to let the players of dead PCs roll up new characters, and we spent the rest of the session doing that, bringing them in at 8th instead. Yes, the half-drow werebear rogue is an ECL 12. I understand that.

I also decided to scrap running them through the RHoD, which is why I had originally told them to roll up 8th level characters. I decided they would still die horribly, and I'm now running something completely different. Mostly, P.o.o.m.a.

Seeing as how I granted them 8 ecl to work with, we now have the former-ranger's-player running a Dwarven Cleric, focusing on hammers and combat smashyness, intending atm to go into Warpriest for general mass buffery, iirc. He has a warforged sorcerer Cohort. His followers haven't been utilized in a game yet, but they're dwarven heavy armor fighters. I think he has them with the phalanx fighting feat. Neither has he rolled a failure on his % check for that armored body. He decided on a blaster cohort after I pointed out the party had no offensive magic or ranged combat ability AT ALL.

The formerly-psiforged's-player is now playing a...lemme make sure I remember it correctly: Half-Black Dragon Half-Giant Crusader. He wields a huge sword, and flies around and strafe's things to death. He's got enough White Raven manuevers he really functions as a battlefield enabler. He's a little smushier than the dwarf, HP wise, but he dishes out nearly four times the damage.

I helped the rogue with the werebear parts, and the new gear, since apparently her boyfriend is a completely incompetant teacher, by her words (and several other people's words, I learned after the fact), and she wanted to not die like his ranger. So she's more or less entirely self-sufficient at this point thanks to magical gear, spends most of her time in hybrid form in combat, and utilizes her natural attacks with her two dagger attacks. If she flanks, or is invisible, or one of a number of things to get her sneak attack dice, she dishes out 18d6 worth of dice (2d6 from rogue, 2d6 from assassin's stance, and her dagger has deadly precision), plus a ton of strength damage. She doesn't mind the lost rogue levels, since she still deals crazy burst damage each round, which is really what she wanted to do in the first place. Plus, she's a freaky ass bear. Did I mention I ruled Wilding Clasps to work for lycanthropic changes? Yup, freaky ass bear in armor. Scary on a battlefield to look at.[/spoiler]

[spoiler=And thus the battle is joined]
Going with a more open battlefield type feel to portion of the campaign, which is why the party built like they did. I'm going to probably be pulling heavily from the mini's handbook, heroes of battle, etc. to build on this campaign, and see if I can't manage to teach them how to build hopefully decently contributing characters. Mostly through showing them how a half-way decently optimized character works through battle. They'll function more as an elite strike force type group. I started humming the A-Team theme song. Seriously. I need help, I think.

I'm eventually working in Meepo back into this one, after filling out his stats from the start WotC gave him on his mini stat-card (with some level replacements. 9 fighter? Come on now) and the title of Dragon Lord. It will be kind of similar to RHoD, but not at all. Maybe they can learn after all, the rogue's player picked it up relatively quickly after I sat down and pointed out some things to her. Despite the +4 LA, the crusader's player seems to be picking it up quickly as well, but he's been scouring the CO boards learning some too. I have hope for him when the first words out of his mouth were "I realize this is horribly bad, and terribly inefficient, but I want to play X". He likes the feel of the character, which is good enough for me since he's actually a decent contributor on the battlefield.[/spoiler]

[spoiler=Wyverns and Manticores and besieged cities, oh my!]
So, just to give them a little bit of a test, and to help get the feel for the new abilities of their characters, I threw a couple fights their way. The first fight involved about 30 mook level 2 fighters. They decimated them without too many hits, especially on the dwarf and rogue. Their ACs are upper 20s, which means the lower level guys don't pose too big a threat to them, which is good. They couldn't land a hit on the crusader that actually damaged him either, thanks to crusader strike, Martial Spirit stance, and his delayed damage pool. He forgot his retribution abilities that key off his damage pool as often as he remembered them, but it was a brand new character.

The next fight involved a couple of wyverns the party had to run down and kill fairly easily without too much loss, although the warforged is super-dee-duper squishy. Almost Gelatinous Cube consistency. The dwarf is rethinking how he built him now.

The real test came when the small city they reported back to for mission completion came under siege. I figured I'd tie up the party via air-superiority, give the crusader a chance to enjoy flying. Manticores doing hit and run through city streets was a lot more fun to run that I thought it would be, especially with their poor fly maneuverability. In the end, the bear's kept-near-max jump modifiers allowed her to jump into a manticore or two, and grapple it down to the ground. Weighing a little under a ton helped. The crusader utilized his superior maneuverability to deadly efficiency, and between those two, they managed to one-round a manticore each on a pretty regular basis. The dwarf went up on the wall to help bolster the men via spell assistance, and to lend a hand where he was more useful, having given up on throwing hammers at the manticores when he saw how viciously effective the rest of the party was at dispatching them, and settled for what he could reliably kill: The enemy soldiers attempting to surge over the wall.[/spoiler]

[spoiler="I cast Create Great Swaths of Dead Guys. Err, I mean, Fireball"]
Taking it personally when the enemy tried to force open the gate, the dwarf decided to take care of the guys on the ram, then resuming his position on the wall, had his cohort blast apart the area around the gate with all four fireballs the warforged had that day. He's good at mook crown control, I'll give him that, even the ones who made their reflex saves still died. In the end, one of the manticore, seeing the dwarf and warforged as the biggest destroyer of the army and being out of tail spikes, engaged the dwarf in melee. While not capable of dishing out damage like his other party members, the dwarf didn't do half bad, and definitely recognized his place in the group as a tactical leader for the moment. The werebear climbed up onto the wall in the end, and threw dead manticore bodies into the other army. Between seeing a bear-thing in armor, a warforged laying death into great swaths of men, and a black-scaled giant clad in a funeral shroud (He wears the Ghost Shroud magic item over his mithral armor) breathing acidic breath over their forces, the party clearly won the day for that fight.[/spoiler]

[spoiler=Final Analysis for the two sessions]
While the party started off horribly, they now seem to have learned from the mistakes they made during their first module, and have shored up a lot of the painfully glaring holes in their effectiveness. They are quite pleased with being able to take down 4 on-cr fights back to back before needing to recover abilities, and between the dwarf's spell radii, and the abilities of the Crusader, they are started to really grasp the importance of party tactics. It helps that the Crusader's player has no qualms about speaking up on party tactics now, so they aren't plagued by the up-until-now-horrible tactical decisions of the dwarf's player. We'll see how they do one I throw spells into the mix against them as well. I have good feelings for this, and perhaps after this is all said and done (whether through completion or TPK), I'll be able to run the RHoD. Maybe I'll just have one of them run it instead and show them how it's done.[/spoiler]
[Spoiler]
A gygaxian dungeon is like the world's most messed up game show.

Behind door number one: INSTANT DEATH!
Behind door number 2: A magic crown!
Behind door number 3: 4d6 giant bees, and THREE HUNDRED POUNDS OF HONEY!
They don't/haven't, was the point. 3.5 is as dead as people not liking nice tits.

Sometimes, their tits (3.5) get enhancements (houserules), but that doesn't mean people don't like nice tits.

Though sometimes, the surgeon (DM) botches them pretty bad...
Best metaphor I have seen in a long time.  I give you much fu.
Three Errata for the Mage-kings under the sky,
Seven for the Barbarian-lords in their halls of stone,
Nine for Mortal Monks doomed to die,
One for the Wizard on his dark throne
In the Land of Charop where the Shadows lie.
[/spoiler]

Optimator

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Re: CO Diary: The Unoptimized
« Reply #47 on: March 28, 2009, 09:11:21 PM »
Oh, I know this mindset. Where the point of the game isn't how well you do, it's how badly you do and how prepared you are to go all-out when there's no doubt you need to go all-out. I have this mindset in video-games where you collect items that are one-time-use only. For example, in Left 4 Dead, I like to save a Molotov Cocktail until I know the zombies will be coming fast and long through a bottleneck or when we face the Tank if we don't have tier 2 weapons yet, so he'll definitely die from the fire if we can't hurt him to death within 42 seconds. 42 seconds is the time it takes for a fire to kill the Tank boss infected (zombie), regardless of damage on Expert mode.

What has always jolted me out of this mindset is when I give up inside and wish to redo the campaign, play half-heartedly, die and spectate my teammates who are at 10% of their max health reach the end of the level. It makes me realize that you don't need 99.9% of your max health and save all your pipe-bombs and pain-pills until the very end. If my teammates hadn't used their items when they did against the spontaneous hordes, they wouldn't have made it to the end. You can always find more of these items ahead, it's just not a guarantee you'll find them again which makes them hoardable.

When I say "it's how badly you do", I mean you expect perfection, and anything less, like a swipe from a zombie nabbing a tenth of your health that you believe you could've easily avoided, means the cause is lost. In this mindset, the point isn't to have fun, it's to show everyone else that you're good at the game because you'll be ready when they aren't with the weapons you've hoarded. You need to crack a few eggs to make frittata.

I suffer from this in video games pretty bad. Like, really bad. In D&D, hardly at all.