Author Topic: hunter's eye and cloud of knives cheese  (Read 10836 times)

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Anklebite

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Re: hunter's eye and cloud of knives cheese
« Reply #20 on: January 08, 2009, 08:23:39 AM »
yeah, one free action knife/round per persisted echoing invisible spell cloud of knives is the whole trick...

but if we start by casting one, 24 hours later we have 1 +1+1... up to twenty four, so one spell slot got us twenty four echoing persistent invisible spell cloud of knives.  and this shenanigans carries on day after day, but with adding more spell slots for compounded knifey interest.

but Ihadn't ever thought about doing the trick with persisted telekenisis... good call, but not sure if it is feasable pre-epic

cloud of knives is 2nd lvl, +6 from persistent, +3 from echoing,  which counts as 9th thanks to incantatrix (or as 6th with arcane thesis and invisible spell).

telekenisis is 5th, so i guess that works in a 9th slot. 

either way, both tricks work in the end i guess...  or would, if MotUH could have both 5 lvls in the prestige class and ninth level spells.  although, we can probably add other +0 metamagics to have the telekenisis work.
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8w_gremlin

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Re: hunter's eye and cloud of knives cheese
« Reply #21 on: January 14, 2009, 08:14:31 PM »
Boost caster levels by using the Master Spellthief feat [CMage/CScoundrel?] and take Spellthief as your 1st level, and Ultimate mage...
You can get absurd CL's

Kuroimaken

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Re: hunter's eye and cloud of knives cheese
« Reply #22 on: January 14, 2009, 11:36:22 PM »
While assasin devils are perfectly capable of drinking tea, the concept is nearly as funny as a whisper gnome on a coushioned floating disk... just sitting there drinking tea while everything within rage dies instantly.

I'll give you one better. Have a cat familiar. Call him Mr. Snuggles if you want. Pat, murder, repeat. Have him hiss on occasion when you kill someone, so they'll think the kitty is the one casting the spell, not you.

Also, be bald with a scar under your eye running across your right cheek.
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BowenSilverclaw

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Re: hunter's eye and cloud of knives cheese
« Reply #23 on: January 15, 2009, 06:58:40 AM »
Mr. Bigglesworth :D

Nice one, Kuro :)
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Anklebite

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Re: hunter's eye and cloud of knives cheese
« Reply #24 on: January 15, 2009, 08:50:57 AM »
hmmm..... lets replace the floating disk with a haunt shifted chair (porpuse skeleton, of course) that you can't quite control, and take spell thematics(cat).... and toss on a single level of cleric.

"arrg! this frickin chair! the power of christ compels you!" *rebuke attempt*

*full round action spent orateing*
"that makes me angry.... and when i get angry, mr bigglesworth gets upset.... and when mr bigglesworth gets upset, PEOPLE DIE!"

*500 free actions of knife-pelting doom*

..... i think this thread is now about optimizing Dr. evil...
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ChristopherGroves

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Re: hunter's eye and cloud of knives cheese
« Reply #25 on: January 15, 2009, 12:26:57 PM »
The only real super benefit to both spells combined is the fact that both are in the category of "uncapped CL". 

The multiple-clouds-of-knives should work, however your DM can limit free actions as much as he/she wants ... and the range is short.

The best entry would probably be Spellthief 1 / wizard some / Unseen Seer more for early game just so you can monkey w/ your CL.

Kuroimaken

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Re: hunter's eye and cloud of knives cheese
« Reply #26 on: January 15, 2009, 11:26:20 PM »
Okay, I GOTTA ask... why do people make such a big deal of unseen seer? Gaining CL is great, sure (with no effort on one's part, which is BETTER, and the lost CL can be easily recovered via Practiced Spellcaster anyway) but why is it considered so damn strong?
Gendou Ikari is basically Gregory House in Kaminashades. This is FACT.

For proof, look here:

http://www.layoutjelly.com/image_27/gendo_ikari/

[SPOILER]
Which Final Fantasy Character Are You?
Final Fantasy 7
My Unitarian Jihad Name is: Brother Katana of Enlightenment.
Get yours.[/SPOILER]

I HAVE BROKEN THE 69 INTERNETS BARRIER!


PhaedrusXY

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Re: hunter's eye and cloud of knives cheese
« Reply #27 on: January 16, 2009, 12:19:10 AM »
Okay, I GOTTA ask... why do people make such a big deal of unseen seer? Gaining CL is great, sure (with no effort on one's part, which is BETTER, and the lost CL can be easily recovered via Practiced Spellcaster anyway) but why is it considered so damn strong?

Good skills, and you can add Hunter's Eye to your spell list to gain sneak attack.
[spoiler]
A couple of water benders, a dike, a flaming arrow, and a few barrels of blasting jelly?

Sounds like the makings of a gay porn film.
...thanks
[/spoiler]

Kuroimaken

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Re: hunter's eye and cloud of knives cheese
« Reply #28 on: January 16, 2009, 01:32:25 AM »
Okay, I GOTTA ask... why do people make such a big deal of unseen seer? Gaining CL is great, sure (with no effort on one's part, which is BETTER, and the lost CL can be easily recovered via Practiced Spellcaster anyway) but why is it considered so damn strong?

Good skills, and you can add Hunter's Eye to your spell list to gain sneak attack.

Ah, so it's good basically because it's a skillmonkey spellcaster with full casting... I KNEW there had to be something I was overlooking.
Gendou Ikari is basically Gregory House in Kaminashades. This is FACT.

For proof, look here:

http://www.layoutjelly.com/image_27/gendo_ikari/

[SPOILER]
Which Final Fantasy Character Are You?
Final Fantasy 7
My Unitarian Jihad Name is: Brother Katana of Enlightenment.
Get yours.[/SPOILER]

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Dictum Mortuum

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Re: hunter's eye and cloud of knives cheese
« Reply #29 on: January 16, 2009, 06:46:22 AM »
Okay, I GOTTA ask... why do people make such a big deal of unseen seer? Gaining CL is great, sure (with no effort on one's part, which is BETTER, and the lost CL can be easily recovered via Practiced Spellcaster anyway) but why is it considered so damn strong?

Good skills, and you can add Hunter's Eye to your spell list to gain sneak attack.

Ah, so it's good basically because it's a skillmonkey spellcaster with full casting... I KNEW there had to be something I was overlooking.

Not really, at least according to me. It's the combination of beautiful things that matters. Full caster level, 6+ skills, sneak attack, free feats, some abilities, extra known spells, easy requirements.

//edit: i don't think multiple cloud of knifes work, but even with those two spells active, it's a pretty good combo :)
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Anklebite

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Re: hunter's eye and cloud of knives cheese
« Reply #30 on: January 16, 2009, 07:31:20 AM »
The only problem I can find with having many cloud of knives up is that using each is a "*free action*, and the DM is allowed and encouraged by RAW to limit this number....  but other than that, it actually does work.
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Kuroimaken

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Re: hunter's eye and cloud of knives cheese
« Reply #31 on: January 16, 2009, 09:55:18 AM »
Quote
Not really, at least according to me. It's the combination of beautiful things that matters. Full caster level, 6+ skills, sneak attack, free feats, some abilities, extra known spells, easy requirements.

I don't find the requirements to be very easy... that's a LOT of skill points. Which would be your recommended entry method?
Gendou Ikari is basically Gregory House in Kaminashades. This is FACT.

For proof, look here:

http://www.layoutjelly.com/image_27/gendo_ikari/

[SPOILER]
Which Final Fantasy Character Are You?
Final Fantasy 7
My Unitarian Jihad Name is: Brother Katana of Enlightenment.
Get yours.[/SPOILER]

I HAVE BROKEN THE 69 INTERNETS BARRIER!


Caelic

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Re: hunter's eye and cloud of knives cheese
« Reply #32 on: January 16, 2009, 10:00:27 AM »
Quote
Not really, at least according to me. It's the combination of beautiful things that matters. Full caster level, 6+ skills, sneak attack, free feats, some abilities, extra known spells, easy requirements.

I don't find the requirements to be very easy... that's a LOT of skill points. Which would be your recommended entry method?


For a full spellcaster?  Able Learner plus Ruathar.

Ruathar has to be one of the most overlooked utility classes in 3.5.

Kuroimaken

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Re: hunter's eye and cloud of knives cheese
« Reply #33 on: January 16, 2009, 12:14:51 PM »
Quote
Not really, at least according to me. It's the combination of beautiful things that matters. Full caster level, 6+ skills, sneak attack, free feats, some abilities, extra known spells, easy requirements.

I don't find the requirements to be very easy... that's a LOT of skill points. Which would be your recommended entry method?


For a full spellcaster?  Able Learner plus Ruathar.

Ruathar has to be one of the most overlooked utility classes in 3.5.

Ruathar? Where the heck is THAT one from?
Gendou Ikari is basically Gregory House in Kaminashades. This is FACT.

For proof, look here:

http://www.layoutjelly.com/image_27/gendo_ikari/

[SPOILER]
Which Final Fantasy Character Are You?
Final Fantasy 7
My Unitarian Jihad Name is: Brother Katana of Enlightenment.
Get yours.[/SPOILER]

I HAVE BROKEN THE 69 INTERNETS BARRIER!


Stratovarius

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Re: hunter's eye and cloud of knives cheese
« Reply #34 on: January 16, 2009, 12:43:29 PM »
Races of the Wild, it's an "Elf-Friend" class.
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Kuroimaken

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Re: hunter's eye and cloud of knives cheese
« Reply #35 on: January 16, 2009, 03:14:14 PM »
Races of the Wild, it's an "Elf-Friend" class.

I didn't know the Races of books had classes at all.

*corrects class count* OK, D&D has 55 classes then.
Gendou Ikari is basically Gregory House in Kaminashades. This is FACT.

For proof, look here:

http://www.layoutjelly.com/image_27/gendo_ikari/

[SPOILER]
Which Final Fantasy Character Are You?
Final Fantasy 7
My Unitarian Jihad Name is: Brother Katana of Enlightenment.
Get yours.[/SPOILER]

I HAVE BROKEN THE 69 INTERNETS BARRIER!


PhaedrusXY

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Re: hunter's eye and cloud of knives cheese
« Reply #36 on: January 16, 2009, 07:07:38 PM »
Races of the Wild, it's an "Elf-Friend" class.

I didn't know the Races of books had classes at all.

*corrects class count* OK, D&D has 55 classes then.
There are several (in)famous ones from them, like Shadowcraft Mage.
[spoiler]
A couple of water benders, a dike, a flaming arrow, and a few barrels of blasting jelly?

Sounds like the makings of a gay porn film.
...thanks
[/spoiler]

Caelic

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Re: hunter's eye and cloud of knives cheese
« Reply #37 on: January 16, 2009, 07:54:10 PM »
Races of the Wild, it's an "Elf-Friend" class.

More to the point, it's an "Elf-Friend" class that gives a pure caster 3 levels of medium BAB, good Ref and Will saves, a decent skill list with 4 skill points per level, full casting, and assorted abilities ranging from low-light vision through a 50% increase in lifespan.

And to get into this class, you have to give up...nothing.

Dictum Mortuum

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Re: hunter's eye and cloud of knives cheese
« Reply #38 on: January 16, 2009, 07:58:20 PM »
Quote
Not really, at least according to me. It's the combination of beautiful things that matters. Full caster level, 6+ skills, sneak attack, free feats, some abilities, extra known spells, easy requirements.

I don't find the requirements to be very easy... that's a LOT of skill points. Which would be your recommended entry method?

Spellthief/Rogue/Factotum 1 with able learner/Caster 4-5/Unseen Seer all the way to benefit from Unseen Seer's sneak attack ability.
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Caelic

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Re: hunter's eye and cloud of knives cheese
« Reply #39 on: January 16, 2009, 08:06:11 PM »
Spellthief/Rogue/Factotum 1 with able learner/Caster 4-5/Unseen Seer all the way to benefit from Unseen Seer's sneak attack ability.


Yeah, that's a bit of a gray area.  I've been able to successfully argue for gaining one of the three abilities if you don't already have it within my own group.  (The class doesn't say you don't gain the ability if you don't already have it unlike some other classes.)

If playing with a group that rules differently, then a level of Spellthief is definitely warranted.