Author Topic: Going up against gods - kind of  (Read 12084 times)

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ChristopherGroves

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Re: Going up against gods - kind of
« Reply #60 on: December 04, 2008, 12:36:00 PM »
Alter Reality is plain good though.  It really is.  That should be your primary focus if you're going to sink the LA.

Agita

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Re: Going up against gods - kind of
« Reply #61 on: December 04, 2008, 01:24:31 PM »
Alter Reality is plain good though.  It really is.  That should be your primary focus if you're going to sink the LA.
Exactly. So, my current idea is:

1. Hexblade 3 into Succubus

Starting Stats (At level 10/15, not couting Alter Reality):
Str 8 or 9 (8 or 9/10 or 11)
Dex 14 or 15 (16 or 17/16 or 17 or 18)
Con 14 (16/16)
Int 12 (16/18)
Wis 8 (10/10)
Cha 18 or 17 (30 or 29/35 or 34)

Feats: Personal Firearms Proficiency (Bonus), ?? (Human Bonus), ??

Lots of equipment

Gets Leadership at 7th and Mettle at 3rd.

2. Hexblade 1/Succubus 12/Hexblade +2

Starting Stats (At level 10/15, not couting Alter Reality):
Str 8 or 9 (8/10)
Dex 16 or 15 (19 or 17/20 or 18)
Con 14 (16/16)
Int 14 or 13 (18 or 17/20 or 19)
Wis 8 (10/10)
Cha 16 or 17 (29/33)

Feats: Personal Firearms Proficiency (Bonus), ?? (Human Bonus), ??

Lots of equipment

Gets Leadership at 11th and Mettle at 15th.

More things that beget thinking about are choice of domains and signature item (see here). For domains, I was thinking along the lines of Fate, Luck, and Magic, but these are by no means set in stone. As for the signature item... no idea. I'm looking at either a laptop with utility enchantments or a Barret Light Fifty (which I'll use as a weapon when things don't go my way).
It's all about vision and making reality conform to your vision. By dropping a fucking house on it.

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ChristopherGroves

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Re: Going up against gods - kind of
« Reply #62 on: December 04, 2008, 02:52:40 PM »
For your character, I'd consider the following domains ... you're not a primary caster so you want to focus on things that provide better benefits.  You will get some of the domain abilities as SLAs ... but I'd pick from the following:

* Competition ... +1 to opposed checks, decent enough spells for SLAs ... the divine rules say you get the power 1/day per divine rank unless a cleric would get it more ... and this should mean it works for EVERY check since clerics get it unlimited

* Mysticism ... 1/day (or 1/day per divine rank) get CHA as a bonus to saves for 1/round per cleric level (divine rank) ... greater visage of the deity is an untyped increase to your attributes (lesser is enhancement)

* Time ... improved init and some great SLAs (time stop, permanency, contingency)

* Luck ... 1 reroll/divine rank = good

* Charm ... untyped +4 CHA 1/day/divine rank

* Family ... give CHA creatures a +4 dodge bonus to AC for 1 round/divine rank (can include yourself) ... 1/day/divine rank

* Renewal ... 1/day/divine rank when dropped to between 0 and -10 you heal back to 1d8+CHA positive hit points

Others to consider
* Domination - fits the flavor
* Mind - some skill bonuses
* Pride - rerolling 1s is always fun ...


Pride can be fun when combined with Luck ... if so, definitely consider Fortune's Friend PrC ... (advance Hexblade if you have to) ... if you do go that route, I'd really recommend skill focus (k-religion) and divine oracle (again, advance Hexblade if you have to) to get Prescient Sense (evasion in armor), Uncanny Dodge, Improved Uncanny Dodge, etc.


Agita

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Re: Going up against gods - kind of
« Reply #63 on: December 04, 2008, 03:08:27 PM »
The thing about Pride is that, starting at Divine Rank 1, You don't auto-fail on a 1 anyway. Fate gives Uncanny Dodge, which is swell. Luck has rerolls, which are nice. Mysticism sounds nice, but I dunno how it would fit the character. Charm and/or Mind might work tho.

I'm now actually thinking of going Suel Arcanamach after Succubus to get 3rd level spells, and then Sublime Chord. >_>
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ChristopherGroves

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Re: Going up against gods - kind of
« Reply #64 on: December 04, 2008, 03:23:45 PM »
I get what you're saying on Pride ... I was thinking of it more in the "reroll a really crappy roll" sense.

If the DC is 30, you have +20 to your save, you fail on a 1-9.  If you can reroll the 1, you're in a happier place.

You don't auto-fail, I was just thinking that 1 is still a pretty low dang roll.




ChristopherGroves

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Re: Going up against gods - kind of
« Reply #65 on: December 04, 2008, 03:25:02 PM »
If you go Fate, it should be always on.  Suel -> Sublime is good ... I'd still suggest you follow into Divine Oracle if you can for 4 levels to get another uncanny (which goes to improved) and prescient sense.

Agita

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Re: Going up against gods - kind of
« Reply #66 on: December 04, 2008, 03:29:12 PM »
I get what you're saying on Pride ... I was thinking of it more in the "reroll a really crappy roll" sense.

If the DC is 30, you have +20 to your save, you fail on a 1-9.  If you can reroll the 1, you're in a happier place.

You don't auto-fail, I was just thinking that 1 is still a pretty low dang roll.

Good point.

If you go Fate, it should be always on.  Suel -> Sublime is good ... I'd still suggest you follow into Divine Oracle if you can for 4 levels to get another uncanny (which goes to improved) and prescient sense.
Yar, continuing Sublime Chord with something else is probably the best option. Divine Oracle also gives Evasion, IIRC, doesn't it?
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skydragonknight

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Re: Going up against gods - kind of
« Reply #67 on: December 04, 2008, 03:34:39 PM »
...Fiend of Possession?
It always seems like the barrels around here have something in them.

Agita

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Re: Going up against gods - kind of
« Reply #68 on: December 04, 2008, 03:38:00 PM »
...Fiend of Possession?
Sounds good, except it's in the FF, isn't it?
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ChristopherGroves

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Re: Going up against gods - kind of
« Reply #69 on: December 04, 2008, 03:46:31 PM »
Prescient Sense (Divine Oracle 2) is evasion but it works in armor.  Uncanny (which would be improved since you already have Uncanny from the Fate domain) comes at 4th.  If you don't take the fate domain, stick in Divine Oracle for 6 levels (it gets improved then).  Level 10 makes you immune to surprise, if you want to go the whole way.

ChristopherGroves

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Re: Going up against gods - kind of
« Reply #70 on: December 04, 2008, 03:51:33 PM »
By the way, if you don't want to go Suel / Sublime Chord, consider Divine Crusader.

One thing I'd consider if Alter Reality is nerfed would be to cram Hexblade / Whatever in front of Divine Crusader, then advance with Divine Oracle and Fortune's Friend.  Your CL will be ... less than stellar ... but you can snag 9th level spells and set up for Epic Spellcasting.

carnivore

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Re: Going up against gods - kind of
« Reply #71 on: December 04, 2008, 07:24:53 PM »
With a starting 14 in Cha I won't qualify for Alter Reality by 10th, though. Even if I go Succubus straight away, I get +12 Cha by Succubus 9, which amounts to 26 with Cha 14 before Racials, or 28 if I put both stat increases in it. With a 16 starting Charisma, it would work with just one level increase in Cha. With a starting 18, it would work out without any stat increases at all, but that pretty much bars Dex 18 as well.

ok ....try this... still go for the Succubus first, but use these stats



10 Str(8 +2 Racial)
18 Dex(16 +2 Racial)
16 Con(14 +2 Racial)
20 Int(14 +6 Racial)
12 Wis(8 +4 Racial)
32 Cha(16 +16 Racial)

all level boosts go to: 1 Cha, the other 4 to Dex

the Key is to get the best Salient Abilities first..... from what i can see  use this order:

1st: Divine Fire Mastery..... Immunity to Fire, and The deity has complete control over all nonmagical fire and can duplicate the effect of any spell with the fire descriptor as a standard action.

thus you can cast Meteor Swarm @ 5th lvl  :smirk

2nd: Alter Reality ... or if not allowed, Divine Earth Mastery for versatility, Divine Blast for a Combat oriented character

 :D

Agita

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Re: Going up against gods - kind of
« Reply #72 on: December 04, 2008, 07:43:52 PM »
The X Masteries are indeed pretty nice, though they all require their respecitve element domain, read: Crappy granted power, mediocre spells. =/
Alternatively, Control Creatures seems like a pretty good option to pick up at 5th, as does Know Secrets.
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carnivore

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Re: Going up against gods - kind of
« Reply #73 on: December 05, 2008, 07:21:21 AM »
with this type of campaign .... normal optimization rules dont necessarily apply

with Salient Abilities ..... they give benifits that will override the minor costs ... dont worry about the Domains , since you can always choose Extra Domain if you really want

 :D

PhaedrusXY

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Re: Going up against gods - kind of
« Reply #74 on: December 05, 2008, 01:44:10 PM »
You know what the difference between a Succubus and an Incubus is?
[spoiler]A standard action.[/spoiler]
[spoiler]
A couple of water benders, a dike, a flaming arrow, and a few barrels of blasting jelly?

Sounds like the makings of a gay porn film.
...thanks
[/spoiler]

carnivore

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Re: Going up against gods - kind of
« Reply #75 on: December 05, 2008, 02:32:50 PM »
heres how i would do it:

Succubus 12/ Bard 7/ Sublime Chord 2/ Divine Crusader 2/ Mystic Theurge 7...... at 30th lvl

@20th lvl
10 Str(8 +2 Racial)
22 Dex(16 +2 Racial +4 lvls)
16 Con(14 +2 Racial)
20 Int(14 +6 Racial)
12 Wis(8 +4 Racial)
33 Cha(16 +16 Racial+1 lvl)

@30th lvl
10 Str(8 +2 Racial)
24 Dex(16 +2 Racial +6 lvls)
16 Con(14 +2 Racial)
20 Int(14 +6 Racial)
12 Wis(8 +4 Racial)
33 Cha(16 +16 Racial+1 lvl)

if you are able to have Alter Reality Salient Ability... then the Salient Ability Progression is like this(after gaining +5 inherent to All attributes):
[spoiler]
15 Str(8 +2 Racial +5 inherent)
29 Dex(16 +2 Racial +6 lvls +5 inherent)
21 Con(14 +2 Racial +5 inherent)
25 Int(14 +6 Racial +5 inherent)
17 Wis(8 +4 Racial +5 inherent)
38 Cha(16 +16 Racial+1 lvl +5 inherent)[/spoiler]

5th lvl: Divine Fire Mastery
10th lvl: Alter Reality
15th lvl: Know Secrets
20th lvl: Supreme Initiative
25th lvl: Irresistable Blows
30th lvl: Divine Dodge

focus on Cha and Dex

 :D

TheWordSlinger

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Re: Going up against gods - kind of
« Reply #76 on: December 08, 2008, 11:50:35 AM »
The X Masteries are indeed pretty nice, though they all require their respecitve element domain, read: Crappy granted power, mediocre spells. =/
Alternatively, Control Creatures seems like a pretty good option to pick up at 5th, as does Know Secrets.
Extra fuel for DMM is crappy? Since when?
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Agita

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Re: Going up against gods - kind of
« Reply #77 on: December 08, 2008, 12:02:59 PM »
The X Masteries are indeed pretty nice, though they all require their respecitve element domain, read: Crappy granted power, mediocre spells. =/
Alternatively, Control Creatures seems like a pretty good option to pick up at 5th, as does Know Secrets.
Extra fuel for DMM is crappy? Since when?
The extra fuel for DMM bit is very DM dependant, sadly, and apart from that aspect, it's just too niche for me to like it. Secondly, in this game you don't even need DMM, since you can just grab Automatic MM. In this games, that's three strikes against it. In others, it's two. Now, if the DM allowed Turn Elemental to work for DMM, I'd definitely consider them.
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