Author Topic: Reality is after all the funny names!  (Read 18761 times)

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PhoenixInferno

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Re: Reality is after all the funny names!
« Reply #100 on: October 02, 2008, 06:17:29 PM »
I gave it to him!  I'm USEFUL! :)

AfterCrescent

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Re: Reality is after all the funny names!
« Reply #101 on: October 02, 2008, 06:21:20 PM »
*pat pat* Yes, you are. Good, PI. ;)
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Psychic Robot

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Re: Reality is after all the funny names!
« Reply #102 on: October 02, 2008, 06:28:33 PM »
Holy. Fucking. Christ.


Count said Rich people. Not all rich people. Inferring otherwise is a misinterpretation, even if he could have been clearer. In his comment, he was referring to CEOs and their ilk, even if he just said 'rich people'.

Count: Please learn to argue more clearly. The internet can be very nit-picky.
AJ: Stop accusing people who disagree with you of bull shit. You call Count a 'racist' when you have a whole thread dedicated to attacking New Zealanders... :rolleyes You have beef with X-Codes for picking fights with you, but you're picking a fight with Count. Stop trying to get a double standard working for you.
PR: You are just adding to an argument with further misinterpretation. Read an entire thread before making inane comments.
bhu: Please make a new thread for zombie porn, if you're interested. ;)
X-Codes: I know you have issues with AJ, and he with you, but unless you're debating a point of his, please don't throw out random insults. Stay on topic.

Seriously. Fucking. Grow. Up.

Now that that's been addressed...  :backtotopic

Tshern, that's actually a very important difference that should have been made. Bonds are a standard way to raise money for the US. Thanks for that link.
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AndyJames

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Re: Reality is after all the funny names!
« Reply #103 on: October 02, 2008, 06:44:13 PM »
Count: Please learn to argue more clearly. The internet can be very nit-picky.
AJ: Stop accusing people who disagree with you of bull shit. You call Count a 'racist' when you have a whole thread dedicated to attacking New Zealanders... :rolleyes You have beef with X-Codes for picking fights with you, but you're picking a fight with Count. Stop trying to get a double standard working for you.
It is called a "ranting thread with a big arsed notice in the front" for a reason, AC.

Also, there is a difference between trying to show a guy who gets his jollies at killing rich people that he is being a douchebag, and what X-Codes did and I know you are smart enough to see the difference. It is a ridiculous statement for Count to make, but he stood by it. Seriously, what's with all the hate for the rich? All I see are a bunch of have-nots too lazy to work for stuff but want to pull the haves down to their level of poverty and despair. Anyone who is enamoured to the idea of tearing someone down to their level instead of trying to aspire to a hiegher level is a loser by default. They have given up on trying to achieve and instead just try to stop others from achieving.

That is all.

Tshern

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Re: Reality is after all the funny names!
« Reply #104 on: October 02, 2008, 08:41:56 PM »
I gave it to him!  I'm USEFUL! :)
Believe it or not, I had already typed a response to AC saying that I didn't post it here originally, but seems you got there first. I just realized someone whined without reading the link, so I decided to repost it for clarity.

Also, I am surprised. A debate about taxation and I am not the most aggressive person in the thread.

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AfterCrescent

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Re: Reality is after all the funny names!
« Reply #105 on: October 02, 2008, 10:49:23 PM »
You must be getting senile, Tshern.
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PhoenixInferno

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Re: Reality is after all the funny names!
« Reply #106 on: October 02, 2008, 10:51:26 PM »
Man in Gorilla Suit, AC?  What's next?  Man in Leisure Suit? :)

AfterCrescent

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Re: Reality is after all the funny names!
« Reply #107 on: October 02, 2008, 10:52:35 PM »
Heh. That would be amusing. ;)

But don't ask me, I don't make the names. *points at Meg* She's responsible for it all.
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Re: Reality is after all the funny names!
« Reply #108 on: October 03, 2008, 01:13:55 AM »
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PhoenixInferno

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Re: Reality is after all the funny names!
« Reply #109 on: October 03, 2008, 01:16:41 AM »
Hey!


X-Codes

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Re: Reality is after all the funny names!
« Reply #110 on: October 03, 2008, 02:48:48 AM »
"If treasury breaks even:..."
This is the longest stretch EVER.  Even if they're buying up the bad debt at bargain-basement prices, I highly doubt that they'll make enough off the resale of them to buy back the T-Bonds at anything but a loss, and with $700B at stake there's a whole fuckload to lose.  Lets also not forget that $110B in tax breaks have also been attached to this bill (that IS coming out of taxpayer pockets) along with more deregulation of the banking system (what got us here in the first place).  I'll admit there's some good stuff, too (increasing the FDIC insurance benefits from $100K to $250K), but the core of the bill is just plain too risky and the key spending ornaments on it have serious potential to cause long-term damage to the US economy.  Oh, and lets not forget that $700B is an irresponsibly bloated figure thrown out there by the Bush administration, making the problem look far worse than it really is and even causing some damage in and of itself by throwing people into a "Bear" mentality sparking a sell-off of credit market and banking stocks and reducing their capital.

Heck'uva job.

PhoenixInferno

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Re: Reality is after all the funny names!
« Reply #111 on: October 03, 2008, 03:34:17 AM »
The assets have value - its just that no one knows what it is.  A long-term investor, like Warren Buffet or the Treasury agency that will be responsible for doing the sorting, will have the time to figure out what that value is - since Wall Street seems to focus too much on short term results, they sure as heck aren't going to do it.  The current CBO estimate on the bailout's final cost (without the Christmas tree ornaments) is on the order of $20B profit to $20B loss.

Tshern

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Re: Reality is after all the funny names!
« Reply #112 on: October 03, 2008, 07:23:37 AM »
What do you mean with Christmas tree ornaments? I probably read too much of this stuff in Finnish...

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bhu

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Re: Reality is after all the funny names!
« Reply #113 on: October 03, 2008, 07:42:26 AM »

bhu: Please make a new thread for zombie porn, if you're interested. ;)


In mah defense occasionally when you introduce some completely baffling bullshit the people arguing heatedly stop for a split second to go *wtf?*, and with luck it may derail stuff because now the have visions of Bruce Campbell humping dead chicks.  Who needs that visual?  It makes it darned hard to argue.  Unfortunately you guys are made of sterner stuff :D


X-Codes

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Re: Reality is after all the funny names!
« Reply #114 on: October 03, 2008, 08:05:35 AM »
The assets have value - its just that no one knows what it is.  A long-term investor, like Warren Buffet or the Treasury agency that will be responsible for doing the sorting, will have the time to figure out what that value is - since Wall Street seems to focus too much on short term results, they sure as heck aren't going to do it.  The current CBO estimate on the bailout's final cost (without the Christmas tree ornaments) is on the order of $20B profit to $20B loss.
I just don't buy that.  Consider the people who have racked up these debts: people who exploited the system to get money and a free home for a while and people who were exploited by the banking system and got a bad mortgage. 

Of the former, the banks receive foreclosed properties.  Now, they've been trying to auction this stuff off, and it's just not happening.  There was a story about it on 60 minutes where there was an auction of a bunch of houses (I want to say about 50, this was a couple years back) where few of them never even got a bid on them, and then they showed a map of the foreclosed properties the bank owned (i want to say about 200) represented by blue dots and green dots: blue dots were houses to be put up for auction, green dots were houses that were put up for auction and nobody bid on them.

Of the latter, these people have been sinking a lot of money into their mortgages already, and bankruptcies are happening.  In other words, these people have all debts and no money and the government is proposing to buy up that debt.  It'd have to be a pretty damn sweet deal for me to even consider touching these debts.

PhoenixInferno

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Re: Reality is after all the funny names!
« Reply #115 on: October 03, 2008, 04:54:39 PM »
What do you mean with Christmas tree ornaments? I probably read too much of this stuff in Finnish...
Legislation often gets little spending bits attached to it - usually they get snuck into the bill at some point in committee.  In this case, there were things added to the Senate version of the bailout bill like extension of renewable energy tax credits for individuals and businesses.

They (the add-ons) get added to the tree (the bill itself) like Christmas ornaments.

Tshern

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Re: Reality is after all the funny names!
« Reply #116 on: October 03, 2008, 08:53:58 PM »
Thanks for explaining that with all the baby steps. The Finnish version of the term is by no means similar, so I had no idea.

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altpersona

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Re: Reality is after all the funny names!
« Reply #117 on: October 03, 2008, 09:48:44 PM »
iv got to quit reading political threads...

i keep wanting break things..

anywho,

that christmas treeing is a big part of whats wrong with the senate structure.

that and they pass to many bills to start with..

much of what they do is in the interest of wrong..

they pass bills to justify their existence/ importance.

they pork barrel the bills they pass to enrich special interest, their interests. their undo relationship interests...

they do a damn fine job of embarrassing them selves, enriching the already wealthy and pissing me off..

a term in top level government should should have a requirement of suicide after voting yes on 10 bills.
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Tshern

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Re: Reality is after all the funny names!
« Reply #118 on: October 13, 2008, 07:51:33 PM »
For giggles I'll tell you a few nice details about those 700 billion dollars.

You could fuel every single car in the USA for 16 months.

You could buy every NFL, NBA and Major League Baseball team, build all of them a new stadium and hire all the players with 181 million a piece for a year.

You could create the 17th largest economy in the world.

You could pay the income taxes of all Americans who make less than 500k a year.

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X-Codes

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Re: Reality is after all the funny names!
« Reply #119 on: October 14, 2008, 08:24:23 AM »
You missed how long it could provide free preschool through graduate level college to everyone in the United States, or how long it could provide free Healthcare to everyone in the United States.  It's at least 3 years worth of either, isn't it?