Author Topic: The Beginning of the End  (Read 4647 times)

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X-Codes

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The Beginning of the End
« on: October 19, 2011, 01:09:38 PM »
As I have stated before, I'm highly interested in playing a character that brings about the zombie apocalypse (or, at least, intends to).  That said, I'm having some trouble putting together everything I want in a nice, compact build, especially if I want to do a Dread Necromancer focus.  Here's what I have so far...

Wizard 1 (Precocious Apprentice, Extend Spell)
Dread Necromancer 4 (Practiced Spellcaster [Wizard])
Ultimate Magus 7 (Persistent Spell, Fell Animate, Undead Battery)
Dread Necromancer +4
Archmage 1
Ultimate Magus +3

Results: DN Casting: 18, Wizard Casting: 9
Spells added to DN list-
Arcane Disciple [Hunger], because I want too many spells from that domain, although a dip for the Hunger domain would be nice, too...
EDIT: Motherfucking Cyst.  Can't believe I forgot that one...
1st Advanced Learning - 2nd or lower Necromancy from Cleric or Sor/Wiz list
2nd Advanced Learning - 7th or lower Necromancy from Cleric or Sor/Wiz list (Thinking Animate Dread Warrior)
Expanded Spell Knowledge 1 -
Expanded Spell Knowledge 2 -
Expanded Spell Knowledge 3 -
Expanded Spell Knowledge 4 - Don't know about any of these, really.
Expanded Spell Knowledge 5 - Necrotic Skull Bomb

I'll add more later, I have to go for now.
« Last Edit: October 19, 2011, 07:52:53 PM by X-Codes »

sirpercival

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Re: The Beginning of the End
« Reply #1 on: October 19, 2011, 02:11:35 PM »
So, basically what you want to do is turn the entire world into zombies, correct?  I assume they don't necessarily have to be under your control... throwing down fell animating AftS would be a start.  Or, maybe fell animating Evil Weather?  A lot of commoners could be killed with 1d3 damage per round from a rain of frogs, and though it has a smaller area of effect you don't need an artifact to cast it.

Actually... fell animating Pestilence.  :)
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SorO_Lost

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Re: The Beginning of the End
« Reply #2 on: October 19, 2011, 02:15:57 PM »
UM required?

Pale Master loses one CL but gives you a component free Animate Dead and later immunity to Nonlethal Damage, which combined with the Magical Location Shiver makes you immune to damage unless it is both Good and Chaotic.

Honestly you can simply dip Dread Necromancer for it's Turn Undead and skip the increased HD limit. With Liched Loved freed undead won't attack you, and as the hellbringer of the necropoclypse you can't tie your self to a couple Hydras. that's not a bringer of the undead horde, that's just a pokemon trainer with an undead theme. What you need to do is keep making undead, more and more every single day. Since your champions can be dominated though Control Undead you're not really trading anything off in the long run but now you'd continually be pumping out undead to a point entire towns behind you are zombie invested villages. See also PM's free Animate Dead :p

Edit
Actually... fell animating Pestilence.
Fell Animate requires the spell to deal damage. Pestilence deals zero. And even if augmented like the Locate City Bomb, the disease is passed between people not the spell.
« Last Edit: October 19, 2011, 02:18:39 PM by SorO_Lost »
Tiers explained in 8 sentences. With examples!
[spoiler]Tiers break down into who has spellcasting more than anything else due to spells being better than anything else in the game.
6: Skill based. Commoner, Expert, Samurai.
5: Mundane warrior. Barbarian, Fighter, Monk.
4: Partial casters. Adapt, Hexblade, Paladin, Ranger, Spelltheif.
3: Focused casters. Bard, Beguiler, Dread Necromancer, Martial Adapts, Warmage.
2: Full casters. Favored Soul, Psion, Sorcerer, Wu Jen.
1: Elitists. Artificer, Cleric, Druid, Wizard.
0: Gods. StP Erudite, Illthid Savant, Pun-Pun, Rocks fall & you die.
[/spoiler]

X-Codes

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Re: The Beginning of the End
« Reply #3 on: October 19, 2011, 02:45:26 PM »
I'm actually not a fan of Animate Dead, because Animate Dead and Ghoul Gauntlet share the same HD limit.  On the other hand, Fell Animating spells are uncapped, so I can get access to Skeletons and Zombies that way without eating into my ghoul army.

Also, I would like more rebuking levels built-in because I intend to command Imps and Kocrachons that have been killed and turned into Bone and Corpse creatures, respectively and use them as lieutenants/assistants/whatever.

Finally, UM isn't required, but I want a lot more spells at my disposal than the DN advanced learnings and AD (Hunger) will get me alone.

Also, strongly considering Gravetouched Ghoul for myself.  The Wisdom bump will help nicely with AD, and an at-will Paralysis effect keyed to my Charisma... just nice.

sirpercival

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Re: The Beginning of the End
« Reply #4 on: October 19, 2011, 03:17:43 PM »
What do you mean by "fell animate is uncapped"?  It won't let you go over 2*CL... though I guess that's for a given casting.

Does ability damage count as "damage"?
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I'm not just a druid -- I'm a singing, dancing, Broadway druid.

[spoiler]
Quote from: PhaedrusXY
"You... saved me? So I was dismantled? I... thank you, then. I will not incinerate you."

There's only one character concept worth having, and that's the one you've thrown darts at.
[/spoiler]

X-Codes

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Re: The Beginning of the End
« Reply #5 on: October 19, 2011, 03:50:47 PM »
You're looking at Fell Drain, I assume?  Not sure on that one, but not the way I'm going, anyway.  The only purpose I see for my character in using Wights is to exterminate the living from an area in the most time-efficient manner possible, and for that I would throw a few necrotic skull bombs at clusters of level 1 warriors or commoners, leave, and then come back the next day, round up the Wights, and then eat them with Undead Battery for persistent spells as needed.  If someone manages to kill them off, then I have found a candidate for Dread Warriorship. :p

I prefer Ghouls for my rank-and-file to Wights, because Ghouls are more intelligent and don't go insane when they're not constantly killing shit with energy drain attacks.  In fact, I will leave some villages relatively unharmed, just kill all the warriors, adepts, and PC classes, leave the commoners and experts, and use the place as a source of livestock for my army.  While I don't care if I don't have direct control over every single undead critter ever, having control is preferable to not having control.

sirpercival

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Re: The Beginning of the End
« Reply #6 on: October 19, 2011, 04:01:49 PM »
What I'm trying to envision is some way to produce a snowball effect, so you wouldn't have to actively create the ghouls yourself.

A contagious effect is the best way to do it, if you can figure out a way.
Burn all the microfiche!  Firebomb all the 8-tracks!

I'm not just a druid -- I'm a singing, dancing, Broadway druid.

[spoiler]
Quote from: PhaedrusXY
"You... saved me? So I was dismantled? I... thank you, then. I will not incinerate you."

There's only one character concept worth having, and that's the one you've thrown darts at.
[/spoiler]

X-Codes

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Re: The Beginning of the End
« Reply #7 on: October 19, 2011, 04:06:44 PM »
What I'm trying to envision is some way to produce a snowball effect, so you wouldn't have to actively create the ghouls yourself.

A contagious effect is the best way to do it, if you can figure out a way.
If I had an efficient method of spreading Ghoul Fever, that would work.  Of course, I could also just sacrifice peasants to Dorsedain using the Ghoul Gauntlet spell and get Dark Craft Gold out of it.

Mooncrow

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Re: The Beginning of the End
« Reply #8 on: October 19, 2011, 04:24:39 PM »
Hmm, I think I got some of these ideas from K's old guide, but:

Fel Animate on Acid Splash to finish off enemies.

Awakened Hellwasp Swarm skeleton

Rebuke Shadow - Shadow spawns a horde for you

Spellstitch Create Undead Warrior

sirpercival

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Re: The Beginning of the End
« Reply #9 on: October 19, 2011, 04:30:22 PM »
How about the Bag O' Shadows from recently?  You could make a shadowpocalypse...
Burn all the microfiche!  Firebomb all the 8-tracks!

I'm not just a druid -- I'm a singing, dancing, Broadway druid.

[spoiler]
Quote from: PhaedrusXY
"You... saved me? So I was dismantled? I... thank you, then. I will not incinerate you."

There's only one character concept worth having, and that's the one you've thrown darts at.
[/spoiler]

dither

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Re: The Beginning of the End
« Reply #10 on: October 19, 2011, 05:21:36 PM »
Kill a lot of people (preferably commoners) and don't apologize for it when the authorities get you. Make sure you get the death sentence, probably by demonstrating worship of an evil god (preferably Orcus). Petition your DM to return your character to unlife under your control as a mohrg, then resume killing people so they spawn as zombies.

Quote from: d20 SRD
Mohrgs are the animated corpses of mass murderers or similar villains who died without atoning for their crimes.

It might not work for villains, but a PC should be able to accomplish a zombie apocalypse with enough determination.
« Last Edit: October 19, 2011, 05:23:20 PM by dither »
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sirpercival

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Re: The Beginning of the End
« Reply #11 on: October 19, 2011, 05:25:23 PM »
Or just take Undead Leadership and get a Mohrg cohort, so you can keep your class levels and spellcasting.
Burn all the microfiche!  Firebomb all the 8-tracks!

I'm not just a druid -- I'm a singing, dancing, Broadway druid.

[spoiler]
Quote from: PhaedrusXY
"You... saved me? So I was dismantled? I... thank you, then. I will not incinerate you."

There's only one character concept worth having, and that's the one you've thrown darts at.
[/spoiler]

weenog

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Re: The Beginning of the End
« Reply #12 on: October 19, 2011, 05:27:50 PM »
The down side is you have to be a mohrg.  LA +6 and 14 crappy Undead HD on those things.

Hmmm... Create Spawn is supernatural and it's not tied to any specific attack, it's just "creatures killed by a mohrg rise etc etc".  If you come up with a way to change yourself into a mohrg temporarily, Assume Supernatural Ability should get you the zombie army a mohrg would have.
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sirpercival

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Re: The Beginning of the End
« Reply #13 on: October 19, 2011, 05:45:18 PM »
Polymorph on a Necropolitan?
Burn all the microfiche!  Firebomb all the 8-tracks!

I'm not just a druid -- I'm a singing, dancing, Broadway druid.

[spoiler]
Quote from: PhaedrusXY
"You... saved me? So I was dismantled? I... thank you, then. I will not incinerate you."

There's only one character concept worth having, and that's the one you've thrown darts at.
[/spoiler]

SorO_Lost

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Re: The Beginning of the End
« Reply #14 on: October 19, 2011, 06:16:52 PM »
Does ability damage count as "damage"?
No.

Also, I would like more rebuking levels built-in because I intend to command Imps and Kocrachons that have been killed and turned into Bone and Corpse creatures, respectively and use them as lieutenants/assistants/whatever.
Eh? Even your build had a mere 8 levels of Turn Advancement, that is only enough to Command a maximum of a 4HD creature, and since Kocrachon's have 6HD you can't control them anyway (turn check for max hd affected != your level for rebuke).

They do however only have a +7 Will Save. You can just Bone them* and just use Control Undead. By the time you even get the spell your Save DC is 16+ already and you are Charisma based caster you know.

*Gotta earn Lich Loved some how right?
Tiers explained in 8 sentences. With examples!
[spoiler]Tiers break down into who has spellcasting more than anything else due to spells being better than anything else in the game.
6: Skill based. Commoner, Expert, Samurai.
5: Mundane warrior. Barbarian, Fighter, Monk.
4: Partial casters. Adapt, Hexblade, Paladin, Ranger, Spelltheif.
3: Focused casters. Bard, Beguiler, Dread Necromancer, Martial Adapts, Warmage.
2: Full casters. Favored Soul, Psion, Sorcerer, Wu Jen.
1: Elitists. Artificer, Cleric, Druid, Wizard.
0: Gods. StP Erudite, Illthid Savant, Pun-Pun, Rocks fall & you die.
[/spoiler]

Mooncrow

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Re: The Beginning of the End
« Reply #15 on: October 19, 2011, 06:26:27 PM »
If you want a Mohrg, just create one at 18th.  That's going to be a better option than trying to make yourself one, or spending feats on it. 

(of course, if you can get shapechange, then, as weenog mentioned, can spawn yourself all sorts of nastiness.)

X-Codes

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Re: The Beginning of the End
« Reply #16 on: October 19, 2011, 07:32:32 PM »
How about the Bag O' Shadows from recently?  You could make a shadowpocalypse...
Shadows have that "go insane if they don't kill everything" flaw that wights have, too.

Also, I would like more rebuking levels built-in because I intend to command Imps and Kocrachons that have been killed and turned into Bone and Corpse creatures, respectively and use them as lieutenants/assistants/whatever.
Eh? Even your build had a mere 8 levels of Turn Advancement, that is only enough to Command a maximum of a 4HD creature, and since Kocrachon's have 6HD you can't control them anyway (turn check for max hd affected != your level for rebuke).

They do however only have a +7 Will Save. You can just Bone them* and just use Control Undead. By the time you even get the spell your Save DC is 16+ already and you are Charisma based caster you know.

*Gotta earn Lich Loved some how right?
1) I'm probably going to be undead, so Lich Loved is kinda redundant.

2) With a Rod of Defiance, a Bone Imp is essentially a -1 HD creature for rebuking (possibly 1 HD, if someone shows me a rule where 1 is the minimum HD for purposes of turning), and a Corpse Kocrachon is a 2 HD creature.  If we go strictly by HD at that point, I can bring along a scepter of the netherworld (or even just pick up the Improved Turning feat, if I was so inclined), and get a Corpse Kocrachon and a Bone Imp under my command, at the very least.  There are also the options of having Dread Warrior Clerics with similar forces at their command.  Honestly, having 1 of each for each of my Dread Warriors (afterall, Dread Warriors are going to be my most powerful servants) would be ideal, and not difficult.

EDIT: The big thing I'm wondering about is what spells I should add to my spontaneous casting side...  Through my various classes, I've got a free 2nd-level Necromancy spell from the Cleric or Wizard list (thinking Curse Water), and one Sorcerer/Wizard spell from each of 1st through 4th levels.  Evocation and Enchantment will probably be prohibited.
« Last Edit: October 19, 2011, 07:56:47 PM by X-Codes »

Endarire

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Re: The Beginning of the End
« Reply #17 on: October 19, 2011, 09:31:38 PM »
What about negative energy + wights?  They're icky and close to being zombies, but smarter.
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Re: The Beginning of the End
« Reply #18 on: October 19, 2011, 09:38:29 PM »
Polymorph on a Necropolitan?
That won't work. Polymorph is Living Creatures Only. PAO or Metamorphosis, though...

However, if you took Human Heritage, you could do it. Maybe.

You really WOULD be the living dead.
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SorO_Lost

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Re: The Beginning of the End
« Reply #19 on: October 19, 2011, 09:47:59 PM »
<snip>
1. It's a note of the very witty pun I made, like saying no pun intended but with more humor and less lying.

2. I don't think Turn has a minimum HD limit per say, but I know fractional HD is counted as 1 HD. Could HD < 1 ? = 1 be pulled out of the rules for it? idk, too lazy to look. What interesting me is the fact once the undead step away from you they regain their normal effective HD. That is, Kocrachon has 6HD and the Imp's 3 make 9, or above your cap (8) forcing you to release one (the imp, they suck). So cudos on teaching me a new way to obtain a Slaymate, you never let those leave your sight.

3. Spells, lets face it. I'm still on the "horde" part of undeadpocalypse but have two suggestions.
(Chained) SadismBoVD: All your minions of evil get luck bonuses to their rolls.
Mass Snake's SwiftnessSpC: All your minions of evil make an attack, you'll want this on you prime casting side for Twin/Repeat.

Tiers explained in 8 sentences. With examples!
[spoiler]Tiers break down into who has spellcasting more than anything else due to spells being better than anything else in the game.
6: Skill based. Commoner, Expert, Samurai.
5: Mundane warrior. Barbarian, Fighter, Monk.
4: Partial casters. Adapt, Hexblade, Paladin, Ranger, Spelltheif.
3: Focused casters. Bard, Beguiler, Dread Necromancer, Martial Adapts, Warmage.
2: Full casters. Favored Soul, Psion, Sorcerer, Wu Jen.
1: Elitists. Artificer, Cleric, Druid, Wizard.
0: Gods. StP Erudite, Illthid Savant, Pun-Pun, Rocks fall & you die.
[/spoiler]