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Tenebrus

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Tier Question
« on: October 13, 2011, 10:59:57 PM »
I like the proposal to merge the sucky warlock and the sucky shadowcsater into a less sucky whole.  Absent an attack based on pure Fluff, how would people rate the class tier-wise?

This class gets both 13 invocations, 20 Mysteries, and an eldritch blast.  Attacks and saves as Shadowcaster.  Skills probably as Warlock, maybe import a bit from the SC list.  HD d6. SP 4+.
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JaronK

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Re: Tier Question
« Reply #1 on: October 13, 2011, 11:21:17 PM »
Warlocks are already pretty decent, and their main problem is lack of flexibility.  Adding in the Shadowcaster would probably be enough to take them to T3 (certainly, if they have fun with magic item creation they can get there).

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veekie

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Re: Tier Question
« Reply #2 on: October 14, 2011, 12:07:30 AM »
Theres already a warlock-shadowcaster in Homebrew I think.
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Tenebrus

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Re: Tier Question
« Reply #3 on: October 14, 2011, 02:29:10 AM »
Yep.  I saw it but was wondering what the community thought tier-wise.
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Nachofan99

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Re: Tier Question
« Reply #4 on: October 14, 2011, 02:59:31 PM »
Definintely high T3.
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Empirate

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Re: Tier Question
« Reply #5 on: October 18, 2011, 07:43:30 AM »
Seeing how you'd get spammable abilities via invocations, and specificity of options vie mysteries, you'd have one heck of a versatile character. You'd never be without something useful to do. Some of the time just spamming one trick over and over will be enough to overcome a challenge; at other times, you have more powerful, but more use-limited options to fall back on. I see this as tier 2, as it's probably easily on par with a Favored Soul or a Binder with online vestiges.

I like the flavor, I like the general idea. However, I think the normal Warlock is quite OK, a nice and balanced base class for most campaigns. Shadowcasters can be modified in different ways to take away from their suckage. Combining the two somehow seems a bit preposterous to me - you might as well go sticking all Ninja class features on a Warmage or something.
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Tenebrus

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Re: Tier Question
« Reply #6 on: October 18, 2011, 12:16:24 PM »
Appreciate the feedback.  I don't think a mix of the 2 is nonsensical: the warlock has his supernatural abilities, the SM abilities become supernatural.  Rather than demon-blooded, this caster comes from some kind of Shadow bloodline. 

I also like warlocks but they can be very dull to run and the premise of the tier system isn't completely about when you're good at your role but also how often you have anything to contribute in different situations.  Mysteries also don't seem all that powerful compared to their arcane counterparts so adding the damaging oomph of the eldritch blast seems to fit.

Tier 2 is what I'm aiming for, at least in the neighborhood of other full casters.  What if the combo only got a "shadowblast" like an eldritch blast and no invocations? 
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