Concerning a Druid's (or Ranger's) Animal Companion

[Vaerenth]

I recently found in a Dragon magazine a question that was posed about a druid's animal companion.

From Dragon #330:
When a Druid reaches the equivalent of 3rd level, does his wolf animal companion grow to Large size (with all benefits of and penalties of the size increase?) Does a wolf automatically become Large if your druid of 3rd or higher level acquires it as an animal companion, granting it bonus HD?

Response:
The animal companion rules- or for that matter, pretty much any other effect that grants a creature bonus Hit Dice - don't use the monster improvement rules presented in Chapter 4 of the Monster Manual. The rules in the Monster Manual are for creating tougher versions of existing monsters, not for increasing the statistics of creatures who somehow gain HD.

Thoughts on this? Is this old news and everyone ignores it or do most people here not know of this ruling.
To me it seems kinda crap. Why does the Animal Companion not follow advancement rules?

[PhaedrusXY]

It is old news, and people do follow it for the most part. ACs don't grow in size due to adding hit dice. I think this was addressed in a D&D FAQ or something a long time ago, also.

[Vaerenth]

Well, wouldn't this fact alone size down the power of a druid's animal companion?

[Mooncrow]

Well, wouldn't this fact alone size down the power of a druid's animal companion?

Not really - it's generally better to swap companions as new ones are available anyway.  (certain animals excepted)

[Vaerenth]

Hmmm, it really doesn't make much sense for a druid to just swap his animal companion when he level ups. Always thought of Animal companions as that, Companions. Not tools to be tossed aside when a new model is available.

[Mooncrow]

Hmmm, it really doesn't make much sense for a druid to just swap his animal companion when he level ups. Always thought of Animal companions as that, Companions. Not tools to be tossed aside when a new model is available.

That's really neither here nor there when talking about the power of a class feature though^^

That complaint is why they added the alternate advancement in 3.5 though; in 3e you had to get a new AC every level if you wanted something level appropriate.

[AriasDerros]

Still better than getting no advancement to them other than getting more. I vastly prefer getting one good wolf over a pack of useless fur-balls like 3.0 did.

And can you imagine if they did grow up and get advanced as normal how much more over-powered ubermount would be? I mean some people still try to do it that way, but they just prove how bad that is to do.

[kitep]

Is this old news

It's new news to me.  I'm guessing it applies to the paladin's mount as well?

We probably won't change for our current game, but will apply it in the future.

[veekie]

If they did grow you'd have problems in dungeons, most of the big companions just don't fit indoors.

[Lycanthromancer]

If they did grow you'd have problems in dungeons, most of the big companions just don't fit indoors.

Unfortunately, all but a scant few of the initial animal companions are useless after the first few levels, since they just don't stack up to level-appropriate challenges. A good chunk of that is due to being smaller-sized. Thus you're stuck with the decision to either keep a smaller useless one or upgrade to a much larger one that you have to leave behind occasionally, find a way to transport along with you (which is actually fairly easily done), or just have squeeze through smaller spaces. I'd rather have my pet upgrade as I did, rather than have to leave behind a potentially important part of my character.

Unfortunately, that's not doable with that ruling.

[oslecamo]

I'd rather have my pet upgrade as I did, rather than have to leave behind a potentially important part of my character.

Unfortunately, that's not doable with that ruling.

Because the druid hasn't got a trillion animal buff spells? That are even shared with the animal companion for free when he's running around wildshaped? That's how you upgrade it.

[Solo]

Only if you're running within 5 feet of each other.

And even then, a buffed Dire Bear will be more awesome than your buffed Riding Dog, for he who brings a Riding Dog to a Dire Bear fight will find himself sorely outgunned.

[Lycanthromancer]

Only if you're running within 5 feet of each other.

And even then, a buffed Dire Bear will be more awesome than your buffed Riding Dog, for he who brings a Riding Dog to a Dire Bear fight will find himself sorely outgunned.

And it's hard to imagine fluffy little Rex being a match for a tyrannosaurus rex, buffed or not.

[oslecamo]

And it's hard to imagine fluffy little Rex being a match for a tyrannosaurus rex, buffed or not.

If you give them the growths, the exact oposite happens. At 4th level, the wolf would be considerably superior to any of the other 4th level new options for example.

Plus low level animal choices can learn more tricks which would increase the wolf's versatility greatly. It would also be ahead on Will saves and have Evasion so it doesn't just fall to random area control effects from enemies.

If all you care is bloody melee combat, then by all means pick a more bloodthirsty brutish option. Just don't complain when it falls to a confusion or similar effect and turns back on you, or you need for it to perform a more obscure trick.

EDIT:Or, since you're such an adept of refluffing, just keep changing your animal companion and claim it's the same one all the time.

[linklord231]

Didn't we cover this pretty in-depth in Hi Welcome?
IIRC, giving Animal Companions a size advancement made them only slightly better than the non-Animal Companion version.  In my opinion, this more accurately reflects the bond between master and companion.  A trained animal should be better at fighting than a wild one.  Besides, it seems kind of arbitrary and unfair to NOT give the PC's companion a size boost, especially when the DM's mirror match would have it.

[veekie]

^^
Until you realize your druid can't bring his companion into the dungeon with him because it doesn't fit in a tunnel and its a dungeon crawl.

Pathfinder seems to have taken a different approach by outright making the companion PC-class style

[linklord231]

Until you realize your druid can't bring his companion into the dungeon with him because it doesn't fit in a tunnel and its a dungeon crawl.

But that applies to some of the alternative animals as well, such as the Tyrannosaurus.  And besides, there are ways to bring your companion along even if he doesn't fit.  Easiest way would be to Baleful Polymorph him into a squirrel or something and have him ride on your shoulder.  Use your lowest possible caster level in case somebody foolishly tries to area dispel, and carry a want of dispel magic.  You automatically win the caster level check to dispel spells you cast yourself, so it's no problem. 

[veekie]

The issue isn't with some companions being too big, but that if you advance them by size, MOST companions wind up too large. When you knowingly pick a Huge companion thats one thing, but if you picked say a Medium Riding Dog, and then it advances to Large and suddenly isn't easily usable for dungeon crawling anymore.

What I'm saying is, either don't do it(because if you want a large companion you can trade it in) or make it a choice(pick a size increase or a stat boost for example, as per the elemental companions)

[linklord231]

The issue isn't with some companions being too big, but that if you advance them by size, MOST companions wind up too large. When you knowingly pick a Huge companion thats one thing, but if you picked say a Medium Riding Dog, and then it advances to Large and suddenly isn't easily usable for dungeon crawling anymore.

This simply isn't true.  The only 1st level animal companion option in the PHB that advances to Large is the wolf.  Everything else either starts Large and stays that way, or starts small and advances to Medium.  The Riding Dog you mentioned (and indeed most animal companions) doesn't gain a size increase at all. 
Also, what kind of dungeons do you go into that can't fit a Large creature?  That severely limits the types of creatures you can find in there.  And if only the corridors are too small, just have your AC squeeze through - you're not in combat, so the penalties shouldn't matter. 
I do like your idea of following the elemental companion example if your AC is eligible for a size increase and you don't want it to though.  Instead of giving it a size boost, give it something like +4 Str and Con?  That could work.

[veekie]

Yep, give the players the choice.