Author Topic: Wizard looks like a Rogue  (Read 4695 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Otovulf

  • Ring-Tailed Lemur
  • **
  • Posts: 23
  • Damn Skippy
    • Email
Wizard looks like a Rogue
« on: September 14, 2011, 03:44:46 PM »
Hello again guys, I have a new DM and he got ants in his pants, so I'm forced into a premade Wizard.  I get to pick a single PrC, after I finish the one he picked out.  We are Lvl 12 and The classes set up for me are Rogue 1 / Wizard 5 / Spellwarped Sniper 5.  I and thinking of Abj. Champion for the next PrC.  This is because if it is a 5 lvl PrC, I can take another one.  (He claims only ten levels of PrC, not counting the SWS since he picked that)  This wizard used to be an npc and did tell the party a few things about himself already.  One he is a Focused Specialist: Envoker.  He gave up Enchantment, Illusion, and Necromancy.  Lucky for me, he did focus on Spell Substitution:Sonic and can turn all his spells into Nonlethal.  He liked to summon often and flank for his SA/RS for an extra 3d6 plus the what ever else the spell does.  Great Thunderclaps often.  I wish this person had Illusion back , but I get to pick the rest of the feats and the spells save a few things.  Items will also be done by me.  Help?  I am thinking of the reserve feat Summon Elemental and Spell Themactics to make my spells all based off Daggers and Flashbangs (DM rewards roleplay very well)   I am thinking a familiar might be a bad idea.  I get 125k to start with and we can fused items (I have a ring of Sustenance and Evasion, single ring for free)  Even ideas for the theme spells would help greatly.  Thank you
So just sorta found out about games like D&D.  Life is good.

Tr011

  • That monkey with the orange ass cheeks
  • ****
  • Posts: 262
  • preparing arcane spellcaster
    • Email
Re: Wizard looks like a Rogue
« Reply #1 on: September 14, 2011, 04:04:17 PM »
You could think about an Unseen Seer since they enhance both the sneaky and the wizard part very well. Also, Advanced Learning is a very cool class feature (I am currently using it for Extended Hunter's Eye from PHB2 to grant me and my familiar SA for 2 rounds so we both sneak up enemies in the first turns of combat using ranged touch attacks).
But wtf is it to give you a sneak attacking spellcaster without illusions? You should totally fix this via items, since Invis, Concealment and Images of yourself would be very useful.

radionausea

  • Domesticated Capuchin Monkey
  • **
  • Posts: 90
    • Email
Re: Wizard looks like a Rogue
« Reply #2 on: September 14, 2011, 04:20:07 PM »
I second Unseen Seer.  There are also feats in Lost Empires of Faerun to give you back your opposition school. There are some in Pathfinder that are better if I remember rightly.

Don't take spell thematics.  You can describe your spells however you want to anyway. Spell thematics just gives you a bonus to opposed spellcraft checks when you do so.
Stronghearted halflings do not exist.

Otovulf

  • Ring-Tailed Lemur
  • **
  • Posts: 23
  • Damn Skippy
    • Email
Re: Wizard looks like a Rogue
« Reply #3 on: September 15, 2011, 05:04:46 AM »
Spell Thematics can end up giving me alot more roleplaying cred and more exp. My DM rewards stuff like that very well.  I like the idea of having more exp then the party to make scrolls and the like.  Unseen Seer?  Explain please?
So just sorta found out about games like D&D.  Life is good.

Dictum Mortuum

  • Hong Kong
  • ****
  • Posts: 1160
  • always female suspects
    • Email
Re: Wizard looks like a Rogue
« Reply #4 on: September 15, 2011, 05:12:39 AM »
Spell Thematics can end up giving me alot more roleplaying cred and more exp. My DM rewards stuff like that very well.  I like the idea of having more exp then the party to make scrolls and the like.  Unseen Seer?  Explain please?


It's in CM. It has a sneak attack advancement (if you already have sneak attack), 6+int skills/level and full caster level advancement!
In addition you get some extra spells to add to your spells known and a caster level boost to divinations. Use practiced spellcaster to offset the penalty. It's wizard + rogue rolled in one convenient, easy to enter package.
What more do you need :P?
Dictum Mortuum's Handbooks: My personal character optimization blog.


Otovulf

  • Ring-Tailed Lemur
  • **
  • Posts: 23
  • Damn Skippy
    • Email
Re: Wizard looks like a Rogue
« Reply #5 on: September 15, 2011, 05:20:09 AM »
Spell Thematics can end up giving me alot more roleplaying cred and more exp. My DM rewards stuff like that very well.  I like the idea of having more exp then the party to make scrolls and the like.  Unseen Seer?  Explain please?


It's in CM. It has a sneak attack advancement (if you already have sneak attack), 6+int skills/level and full caster level advancement!
In addition you get some extra spells to add to your spells known and a caster level boost to divinations. Use practiced spellcaster to offset the penalty. It's wizard + rogue rolled in one convenient, easy to enter package.
What more do you need :P?

Not Much else other then a few choice spells and items I suppose, Thank you very much.
So just sorta found out about games like D&D.  Life is good.

Tr011

  • That monkey with the orange ass cheeks
  • ****
  • Posts: 262
  • preparing arcane spellcaster
    • Email
Re: Wizard looks like a Rogue
« Reply #6 on: September 15, 2011, 09:02:08 AM »
Heroics (SpC) is very handy since there are much nice feats out there you won't have but maybe need for a couple of combats. Also, Alter Self is very useful for rogues to gain fly-speed, swim-speed, natural armor, disguises, natural attacks or another size, my Unseen Seer uses Avariel from Races of Faerun 32 very often to gain a decent skill-bonus, automatic secret-door-finding and 50ft. fly-speed.
Also, you will need all kind of Orbs (Acid Splash, lesser Orb of X and Orb of Fire).

Ivory Knight

  • Curious George
  • ****
  • Posts: 325
Re: Wizard looks like a Rogue
« Reply #7 on: September 15, 2011, 10:24:06 AM »
You could try to get Greater Invis back, or you could try it with Assume Supernatural Ability(Savage Species, needs WIS 13) + Polymorph(Pixie works, there may be other possible forms).

One of the ranged attack Reserve Feats may be a decent backup, in case you run out of spellslots(I'd pick Acid, since there is no decent feat that keys of Sonic spells).
If you summon a monster to flank an enemy with you, Clap of Thunder does key off your highest level spell with sonic damage, but needs a melee touch attack.

CantripN

  • Hong Kong
  • ****
  • Posts: 1199
  • Constantly talking isn't necessarily communicating
    • Cantrip, Gestalt Gish
Re: Wizard looks like a Rogue
« Reply #8 on: September 15, 2011, 11:28:46 AM »
Get a Wand, an Eternal Wand or UMD a Runestaff for Creaking Cacophony. Also, Born of Three Thunders is an option for you, if you adapt it a bit (only need to change the requirement from Lightning to Sonic, which makes sense).

As for a PrC, War Mage (Age of Mortals) and Stormcaster (Stormwrack) come to mind. There's the stuff already mentioned, and stuff like Incantatrix that work, too, but aren't as thematic.
Read, every day, something no one else is reading. Think, every day, something no one else is thinking. Do, every day, something no one else would be silly enough to do. It is bad for the mind to be always part of unanimity.

skydragonknight

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 3297
Re: Wizard looks like a Rogue
« Reply #9 on: September 15, 2011, 11:35:52 AM »
Wouldn't Blink or Greater Blink allow him to SA without Illusion?
It always seems like the barrels around here have something in them.

CantripN

  • Hong Kong
  • ****
  • Posts: 1199
  • Constantly talking isn't necessarily communicating
    • Cantrip, Gestalt Gish
Re: Wizard looks like a Rogue
« Reply #10 on: September 15, 2011, 11:38:21 AM »
Wouldn't Blink or Greater Blink allow him to SA without Illusion?

A Ring of Blinking doesn't seem like such a bad idea, yes. There are several ways to ignore the miss chance.
Read, every day, something no one else is reading. Think, every day, something no one else is thinking. Do, every day, something no one else would be silly enough to do. It is bad for the mind to be always part of unanimity.

Jackinthegreen

  • Barbary Macaque at the Rock of Gibraltar
  • ***
  • Posts: 181
    • Email
Re: Wizard looks like a Rogue
« Reply #11 on: September 15, 2011, 03:17:55 PM »
Not really related, but the title just reminded me of "Dude Looks Like a Lady."

I can't think of anything people haven't already said concerning this character.

KellKheraptis

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 2668
  • What's the matter? I thought you had me...
    • Email
Re: Wizard looks like a Rogue
« Reply #12 on: September 15, 2011, 03:30:01 PM »
What aspect are you emulating?  A Diviner Wizard/Red Wizard can steal the DM's notes, particularly with a Diviner/Red Wizard cohort, and have the "I'm a mafia boss" feel of a rogue, without the 3-4 tier drop in power.
BG's Resident Black Hatter
The Mango List Reborn!
My Warmage Trickery (coming soon!)
My PrC Pally Trickery (coming soon!)
The D&D Archive
-Work in progress!

X-Codes

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 3941
Re: Wizard looks like a Rogue
« Reply #13 on: September 15, 2011, 06:39:23 PM »
I'm tempted to just say "Red Wizard + Leadership + Circle Magic and make your DM cry for forcing you to play his character."

He really should have demonstrated to him that people can royally screw over the game without so much as a single class level if they really wanted to, and that they generally play nicer when they get to pick their own characters.  Afterall, their characters are part of the game world, too, so if they like their character then they're not liable to blow up the game world.

Unseen Seer is the typical progression beyond what you've got so far.  Lost Empires of Faerun has the feats Spell Reprieve, Item Reprieve, and Arcane Transfiguration, which will give you back the full school of Illusion (although if you're just going for Improved Invisibility and don't care about the rest of Illusion, Spell Reprieve is enough).

KellKheraptis

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 2668
  • What's the matter? I thought you had me...
    • Email
Re: Wizard looks like a Rogue
« Reply #14 on: September 15, 2011, 06:45:03 PM »
Here's another idea : Arcane Thesis (Fireball).  Yeah, you heard me right.  Reserves of Strength to remove cap, see if you can swap some feats around to pick up the usual suspects for adding + per die of damage, and then metamagic the unholy fuck out of it.  You're basically a high powered Dragunov of a Warlock, but he'll regret ever letting you use a premade.
BG's Resident Black Hatter
The Mango List Reborn!
My Warmage Trickery (coming soon!)
My PrC Pally Trickery (coming soon!)
The D&D Archive
-Work in progress!

Tr011

  • That monkey with the orange ass cheeks
  • ****
  • Posts: 262
  • preparing arcane spellcaster
    • Email
Re: Wizard looks like a Rogue
« Reply #15 on: September 15, 2011, 08:07:08 PM »
Here's another idea : Arcane Thesis (Fireball).  Yeah, you heard me right.  Reserves of Strength to remove cap
Wow, never heard of that before. Are you sure this removes completely the cap?

CantripN

  • Hong Kong
  • ****
  • Posts: 1199
  • Constantly talking isn't necessarily communicating
    • Cantrip, Gestalt Gish
Re: Wizard looks like a Rogue
« Reply #16 on: September 15, 2011, 09:12:58 PM »
Here's another idea : Arcane Thesis (Fireball).  Yeah, you heard me right.  Reserves of Strength to remove cap
Wow, never heard of that before. Are you sure this removes completely the cap?
Doesn't say, so ask your DM. Any DM I know, if he even allows the feat, only lets it break the cap by the 3 caster level maximum it can grant and no more. It's still a great feat, regardless.
Read, every day, something no one else is reading. Think, every day, something no one else is thinking. Do, every day, something no one else would be silly enough to do. It is bad for the mind to be always part of unanimity.

Otovulf

  • Ring-Tailed Lemur
  • **
  • Posts: 23
  • Damn Skippy
    • Email
Re: Wizard looks like a Rogue
« Reply #17 on: September 18, 2011, 02:20:51 AM »
Thanks guys, the advice has been great.  Any ideas on items though?
So just sorta found out about games like D&D.  Life is good.

skydragonknight

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 3297
Re: Wizard looks like a Rogue
« Reply #18 on: September 18, 2011, 02:45:06 AM »
Ring of the Darkhidden from MIC, for starters.
It always seems like the barrels around here have something in them.

radionausea

  • Domesticated Capuchin Monkey
  • **
  • Posts: 90
    • Email
Re: Wizard looks like a Rogue
« Reply #19 on: September 18, 2011, 04:38:25 AM »
As many items that improve sneak attack as you can get.  (rogue's vestCadv, bracers of murderSoX, mantle of the hunterMiC, assassinationWeb/deadly precisionCadv weapon property)

Sniper's goggles from pathfinder APG lets you sneak attack at any range, or gives +2 damage/dice within 30'.

Standard wizard equipment as well. Metamagic rods, Heward's [descriptive] bedrollCmage so you only need to rest for a short amount of time

 A +1 Eager Spellstrike / +1 Warning Defending quarterstaff (36,600 gp) get greater magic weapon on it.
+5 bonus to AC, +5 to saving throws against spells and spell-like abilities, and importantly a +7 bonus to initiative


Stronghearted halflings do not exist.