Author Topic: Blindsight + Black Luminary  (Read 2410 times)

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Twicekinless

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Blindsight + Black Luminary
« on: August 18, 2011, 12:40:24 AM »
I had an idea for a character that has blindsight and carries around a black luminary (Draconomicon pg. 84) so that no one else is able to see.  However, I did some math and found that a  Black Luminary would weigh roughly 6927 lbs., assuming that steel has a density of 490 lbs/foot.  Does anyone know a really cheap way (other than a permanentized shrink object) to make carrying one of these around feasible?  I was thinking of pulling it behind me in a cart (using myself as a beast of burden) but I have no idea if there are rules for how to fight when hooked up to a cart.  As of now I have about 1k free.  If I need to I can just suck it up and spend the 13830gp at some later date, but i would like to accomplish this as soon as possible.   

weenog

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Re: Blindsight + Black Luminary
« Reply #1 on: August 18, 2011, 12:44:51 AM »
All magical darkness works that way, and that is far from infallible.  Forget the overpriced overweight ball thing and just cast darkness whenever you need it.
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Twicekinless

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Re: Blindsight + Black Luminary
« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2011, 01:04:08 AM »
Normally I would, but I'm not playing a spellcaster.  I'm a feral half-minotaur goliath tank.  I would be a spellcaster, but being unable to see more than 60 ft (the limit of my blindsight) would hurt me more than if I was just a melee character.

weenog

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Re: Blindsight + Black Luminary
« Reply #3 on: August 18, 2011, 01:19:49 AM »
Depending on how much armor you're wearing, I think a 1-4 level Warlock dip could help you a lot.  It's not a genuine spellcaster so being dumb and ugly doesn't matter EDIT: except for saving throw DCs, which you don't care about at all.  Depending on how many levels you take you could at least get Darkness at will, possibly a little damage reduction, Detect Magic at will, two other least invocations, and a much-needed increase to your base Will save.

For a character like this, assuming 4 Warlock levels, the invocations I'd take are Darkness (the effect of that luminary you're so interested in), Entropic Warding (miss chance for ranged attacks against you), and either Spiderwalk (Spiderclimb + ignore webs including Web spells) or See The Unseen (See Invisibility + darkvision).  If you're paying significant resources your blindsight (not sure where that's coming from, maybe half-minotaur?) I'd quit doing that, make the 2nd invocation be Devil's Sight (see in darkness, including see through magical darkness) instead, and move Entropic Warding down to the 3rd invocation spot.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2011, 05:40:05 AM by weenog »
"We managed to make an NPC puke an undead monster."
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Twicekinless

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Re: Blindsight + Black Luminary
« Reply #4 on: August 18, 2011, 02:13:29 AM »
The blindsight is from a houserule my DM made regarding faceless hate (a disease from Book of Vile Darkness).  My character's Dex is way too low for a ranged character to be viable.  For context, my stats are:  STR 34 DEX 6 CON 28 INT 3 WIS 11 CHA 12.  I am a Blackstone Knight 3, a home brew class found here: http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Blackstone_Knight_(3.5e_Class)

My DM wanted all of our characters to have a secret that the other players would have to discover through roleplaying.  My secret is that I have fallen victim  to Faceless Hate.  However, I am not compelled to kill; I just strongly desire killing.  I also take a trophy from each sentient being I kill.  I prefer to take some piece of their clothing and then patch it into my cloak.  I most enjoy killing brides and stealing their veils.  To hide my lack of a face I wear all the veils layered on top of each other, almost like a burqa. 

weenog

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Re: Blindsight + Black Luminary
« Reply #5 on: August 18, 2011, 02:17:23 AM »
Flavorful.  Works with Warlock too, if you want to go there.  Infection with Faceless Hate could be the grim consequence of selling your soul for power.

Definitely pick up Entropic Warding if you do go with Warlock.  Being unable to see anything beyond 60 feet and unable to turn it off means ranged attackers are going to have a field day with you. 20% miss chance from concealment in your darkness field, and a separately checked 20% from the entropic warding effect, gives you 1-(.8*.8) = .36, in other words a slightly higher than 1 in 3 chance that ranged attacks will miss you regardless of your AC.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2011, 02:20:41 AM by weenog »
"We managed to make an NPC puke an undead monster."
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SorO_Lost

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Re: Blindsight + Black Luminary
« Reply #6 on: August 18, 2011, 03:31:44 AM »
Other Magic Items can help?

Dark Lantern(ToM, 2k) shreds darkness like a lantern shreds light, up to shadowy illumination in full day-light, buy two and wear them.
Bottled Night (DotU, 200gp) can be thrown and broken for Darkness.
Rod of Impenetrable Darkness (DotU, 36k) improves your Darkvision by 30 feet and can be used three times a day to cast Deeper Darkness.
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Twicekinless

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Re: Blindsight + Black Luminary
« Reply #7 on: August 18, 2011, 03:39:06 AM »
I just realized I was thinking of darkness as it was in 3.0 (when you couldn't see anything).  After having re-read the spell.  It seems like it would be better to use a fog cloud.  There is also a least invocation that copies that spell, so it would be fairly easy.  Is there any way to make it so that the eldritch blast doesn't rely on Dex?  Even as a ranged touch attack, My BAB is too low (+3) to give me a significant chance of hitting.  I mean I have a -2 DEX mod, so it seems like Ranged attacks are kind of out of the question.  Plus I don't want to be forced to split my feat choices between ranged and melee because I don't really get enough of them as it is.  Also Eldritch Blast never really impressed me that much; unless you go straight warlock, the damage is too small.  Maybe if I used the  Hellfire Warlock PrC (Fiendish Codex 2 pg. 90).  That requires a minimum of 6 levels in warlock though, unless there is some fancy way to get lesser invocations earlier than that.  Plus the CON damage would be kind of painful.  I guess wands/scrolls of restoration would be in order; Use Magic Device is a lifesaver.

Basically I'm wondering if a whole level is worth a permanent fog cloud.  I'm erring on yes, especially because a level of warlock will buff my Will save, which is always helpful for a tank.  I cant even count the number of times one of my characters has been taken out of the fight instantly, or, even worse, turned against the party.

Thanks for all your help weenog.  I would never have thought to look at warlocks.

Also, SorO_Lost, I think i'm heading away from using darkness effects.  I thought it was much better than it actually was, and so am going more with fog cloud and the like.

This brings up an interesting question though:  with faceless hate, i have lost my face.  Thus, how do I eat?  Do I need to breathe?  In the disease description it says that affected creatures lose scent, so I assume I can't breathe anymore.  So maybe I should get some sort of permanentized cloudkill cast on me?
« Last Edit: August 18, 2011, 03:45:59 AM by Twicekinless »

weenog

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Re: Blindsight + Black Luminary
« Reply #8 on: August 18, 2011, 05:35:37 AM »
The invocation that works like fog cloud doesn't directly copy the spell, it doesn't block line of sight like the actual spell does.  You can still gain a concealment benefit out of it like you would with darkness, so it should still help you avoid attacks by way of miss chance, but don't go thinking it will make you go unseen any more than darkness will.  On the plus side, other warlocks with Devil's Sight, and actual devils, won't be able to ignore it easily like they could with magical darkness.

You're too hung up on Eldritch Blast.  If you dip warlock, it's for the invocations, with the Will save, DR and Detect Magic being nice fringe benefits.  The Eldritch Blast is a small extra detail that you don't care about at all, you get those a lot when you're dipping base and prestige classes for specific abilities.  You do not need to ever use Eldritch Blast if you're dipping warlock, especially if you're only dipping it for a few invocations like you're doing here.  If you want to, of course you can, but as you're noticing your build isn't really geared to work with it.  It might not be worth going so far out of your way to try to get some use out of it.  I would actually ask the DM if I could give up Eldritch Blast entirely and get more invocations or some other benefit in its place.

Probably should avoid trying to get a permanent Cloudkill on yourself.  Inhaled vector poisons are an oversimplification, not inhaling doesn't actually protect you from them.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2011, 05:37:23 AM by weenog »
"We managed to make an NPC puke an undead monster."
"That sounds like a victory to me."

Twicekinless

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Re: Blindsight + Black Luminary
« Reply #9 on: August 18, 2011, 01:59:50 PM »
It's a pity that both fog cloud and darkness are 2nd level spells, because otherwise i could just dip a single level of sorcerer and take them both. 

Going back to warlock's though, I'm still not convinced that the dip is worth it.  After all, their Breath of the Night is worse than normal fog cloud.  Thus I would end up taking darkness instead.  But, given I would only dip into warlock for a single level, it will only last ten minutes.  Not only that, but spell resistance applies.  Surrently I am wearing Mechanus gear (Planar Handbook pg. 69) which has an arcane spell failure chance of 50%.  I gues i could just constantly  be casting darkness though.  I'm just not sure if the 20% miss chance is worth it. 

PhaedrusXY

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Re: Blindsight + Black Luminary
« Reply #10 on: August 18, 2011, 02:07:44 PM »
It's a pity that both fog cloud and darkness are 2nd level spells, because otherwise i could just dip a single level of sorcerer and take them both. 

Going back to warlock's though, I'm still not convinced that the dip is worth it.  After all, their Breath of the Night is worse than normal fog cloud.  Thus I would end up taking darkness instead.  But, given I would only dip into warlock for a single level, it will only last ten minutes.  Not only that, but spell resistance applies.  Surrently I am wearing Mechanus gear (Planar Handbook pg. 69) which has an arcane spell failure chance of 50%.  I gues i could just constantly  be casting darkness though.  I'm just not sure if the 20% miss chance is worth it. 
1) You can cast it at will. Just recast it every time the duration runs out.
2) Only if you cast it directly on someone. What you want to do is cast it on yourself, before combat even starts.
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