Author Topic: Jedi Combat Forms via DnD 3.5  (Read 3710 times)

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dark_samuari

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Jedi Combat Forms via DnD 3.5
« on: August 03, 2011, 05:25:03 PM »
So upon my quest to adapt Star Wars into DnD 3.5 I seek your critique and ideas regarding the seven lightsaber forms as demonstrated within the films & literature.

Right now I am using this as the base for lightsabers.

Quote
Basic Model Lightsaber ($11,350 gp or $2,769 with a dedicated Lightsaber crafter)
Sunsword with the Sonic, Focus and Deflecting enchantments with a Lesser Crystal of Return coupled with a Glove of the Master Strategist.
A +1, Masterwork Bastard Sword (treated as a Short Sword whenever advantageous) which does a extra 1d4 points of sonic damage on a successful hit and bestows a +4 insight bonus to the wielder's Iaijutsu focus checks while carrying the weapon, even if the weapon is sheathed. The lightsaber may be drawn as a free action and you may call it to your hand from 30ft away as a move action. In addition you can try to knock projectiles aimed at you out of the air. Once per round when you would normally be hit by a ranged weapon, you may make a DC 20 Reflex saving throw (if the ranged weapon has a magical enhancement bonus, the DC increases by that amount). If you succeed, the ranged weapon or projectile deflects away harmlessly. You must be aware of the attack and not flat-footed. Intrinsically connected to the Lightsaber is the mystical handling glove which allows you to store and retrieve held items into the glove as free actions as well as activate True Strike 1/day.

With a dedicated lightsaber crafter we can knock that price from $11,350 to
$2,769 by using the Extraordinary Artisan, Magical Artisan (Craft Arms & Armor), Apprentice (Craftsman) and Blazing Forge planar touchstone feats in addition to restricting it to only those with a rank in Knowledge (Religion) and those of the Ardent Class (I'm just selecting for all practical intentions).

[spoiler]$7,750 gp / 50% (3,875 gp) = 3,875 gp / 30% (1,162 gp) = 2, 713 gp / 25% (678 gp) = 2,035 gp / 25% (508 gp) = 1,527 gp / 10% (152 gp) = 1,375 gp / 10% (137 gp) = 1,238 gp

$3,600 gp / 30% (1,080 gp) = 2,520 gp / 25% (630 gp) = 1,890 gp /10% (189 gp) = 1,701 gp /10% (170 gp) = 1,531 gp[/spoiler]

Form 1
The basics of lightsaber combat comprised of attack, parry and body zone strikes. It is used primarily for training new Jedi in the use of the lightsaber.
Knowledge Devotion, Psionic Weapon, Greater Psionic Weapon

Form 2
The perfect form for lightsaber-to-lightsaber combat and studied by almost every Jedi. Form II maximizes precision whilst minimizing movement so as not to tire the dueler.
Combat Expertise, Improved Disarm, Einhander

Form 3
This form was developed specifically to counter the threat from laser blasts. As laser blasters spread throughout the galaxy Jedi had to learn to deflect/reflect laser blasts whilst offering the smallest possible target area. From this Form III was born.
Combat Expertise, Stand Still, Improved Combat Expertise

Form 4
The most acrobatic of all the lightsaber combat forms. Practitioners of Form IV took lightsaber combat to incredible new levels with amazing displays of physical prowess that were beyond anybody else. Watching a Form IV Jedi in battle would be difficult because of their ability to leap, spin, jump and fight in all 3 axis.
Dodge, Mobility, Elusive Target

Form 5
As the demand on the Jedi to maintain peace and order grew a more aggressive Form was needed for use in combat. Form V was designed to not only deflect laser blasts but also deflect them back on the attacker. Strength and strong lightsaber attacks feature heavily in this form which was favored more by some Jedi than others.
Power Attack, Improved Sunder, Combat Brute

Form 6
A combination of Forms I, II, III, IV and V. Often referred to as the "diplomats form" this particular style of combat relied less upon combative movement and more upon allowing Jedi time to study diplomacy, galactic politics and their Jedi perception. Considered a lesser form by some Jedi masters it proved to be very popular amongst many Jedi knights.
Sacred Vow, Vow of Peace and Vow of Nonviolence.

Form 7
The ultimate form of lightsaber combat which combines the raw strength of Form V with the graceful movement of Form IV. Only advanced Jedi masters such as Mace Windu can use this form effectively due to the huge emotions involved wielding it. Such is the emotional involvement that many Jedi refuse to study Form VII because it comes too close to the Dark Side of the force. Force assisted jumps and other movements feature heavily in Form VII as do series of sudden, seemingly unrelated, movements. A form VII practitioner will appear utterly calm on the surface but inside is a seething cauldron of emotions.So what I am requesting in this thread are critiques and thoughts regarding the combat form feats, not anything else. If you think there is a better feat to represent Dooku's duelist style of lightsaber combat than Einhander I would love to hear it and beyond but let us try not to immediately delve into discussing homebrew Jedi classes or the mechanics of the lightsaber weapon.

brujon

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Re: Jedi Combat Forms via DnD 3.5
« Reply #1 on: August 03, 2011, 09:01:23 PM »
The best way to represent a Lightsaber in 3.5 would be some variation of the Lantern Archon light ray.
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/archon.htm#lanternArchon

Specifically the bit about overcoming all DR. But, on to the feats... Form 3 mentions deflecting blows, but i don't see Deflect Arrows there. I think it'd be a better fit, only instead of deflecting by hand, you bat it with your sword.  The others seem spot on.

miz redavni

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Re: Jedi Combat Forms via DnD 3.5
« Reply #2 on: August 03, 2011, 09:10:28 PM »
So far it sounds pretty cool.

I think this would get more attention in the homebrew area

dark_samuari

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Re: Jedi Combat Forms via DnD 3.5
« Reply #3 on: August 03, 2011, 09:41:37 PM »
The best way to represent a Lightsaber in 3.5 would be some variation of the Lantern Archon light ray.
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/archon.htm#lanternArchon

Specifically the bit about overcoming all DR. But, on to the feats... Form 3 mentions deflecting blows, but i don't see Deflect Arrows there. I think it'd be a better fit, only instead of deflecting by hand, you bat it with your sword.  The others seem spot on.

I think the reason I avoided giving Form 3 the Deflect Arrows feat was that the lightsaber already possess that ability (via the Deflecting enchantment) so it just seemed to be redundant to a degree.

So far it sounds pretty cool.

I think this would get more attention in the homebrew area

Nothing about it utilizes homebrew material, everything is completely legal within 3.5

In addition I am not requesting anything homebrewed, merely asking for thoughts, advice & critique for feats to pair up with the combat styles.

wO-_-OdrOw

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Re: Jedi Combat Forms via DnD 3.5
« Reply #4 on: August 03, 2011, 10:27:44 PM »
The lightsaber itself is home brewed isnt it? Why not just use Rod of Force?
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dark_samuari

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Re: Jedi Combat Forms via DnD 3.5
« Reply #5 on: August 03, 2011, 10:35:39 PM »
The lightsaber itself is home brewed isnt it? Why not just use Rod of Force?

The lightsaber is simply a Sunsword with the Sonic, Focus and Deflecting enchantments with a Lesser Crystal of Return coupled with a Glove of the Master Strategist. It is not something homebrewed.

Regarding the Rod of Force it is very expensive and simply doesn't follow the idea of a lightsaber. It can shoot a laser, create a wall of force and conjure a 30-foot blade? The lightsaber I presented has the advantage of still technically being a weapon which means combat feats apply to it as do other aspects of the game.

Midnight_v

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Re: Jedi Combat Forms via DnD 3.5
« Reply #6 on: August 03, 2011, 11:10:32 PM »
There was this debat recently on these boards concerning, crafting feats being able "bypass" wbl. Meaning you're wbl is a solid number and you aren't supposed to be able to have anything that surpasses market price no matter what. I'm not sure how it was worded exactly cause it was fringe thinking to me but I'm just pointing out some people and I don't know the quantity reject the notion that WBL give discounts apparently. 
Other than that the builds seem decent. Sunswords a pretty good choice if you cant find a  way fro the blade to be made of actual energy etc.
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dark_samuari

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Re: Jedi Combat Forms via DnD 3.5
« Reply #7 on: August 04, 2011, 12:09:26 AM »
Thanks Midnight, the other advantage that Sunswords offer is the ability to power attack as well as dual-wield if needed which fits nicely with some of the more martial-minded Jedi switching from different combat dynamics.

Lunaramblings

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Re: Jedi Combat Forms via DnD 3.5
« Reply #8 on: August 04, 2011, 12:39:19 AM »
Maybe I am missing it, but is the sunsword different than the Sun Blade in the DMG because that costs 50,335gp, which is insanely more than what this is listed as costing??

dark_samuari

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Re: Jedi Combat Forms via DnD 3.5
« Reply #9 on: August 04, 2011, 01:07:04 AM »
Sunsword (perhaps it is the Sun blade) comes at a radically cheaper price in Expedition to Castle Ravenloft. The cheaper version only comes as a +1 Bastard Sword that can be treated as a short sword whenever advantageous.

Phaenix

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Re: Jedi Combat Forms via DnD 3.5
« Reply #10 on: August 04, 2011, 01:32:08 AM »
The best way to represent a Lightsaber in 3.5 would be some variation of the Lantern Archon light ray.
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/archon.htm#lanternArchon

Specifically the bit about overcoming all DR. But, on to the feats... Form 3 mentions deflecting blows, but i don't see Deflect Arrows there. I think it'd be a better fit, only instead of deflecting by hand, you bat it with your sword.  The others seem spot on.

I think the reason I avoided giving Form 3 the Deflect Arrows feat was that the lightsaber already possess that ability (via the Deflecting enchantment) so it just seemed to be redundant to a degree.

Since your Deflection enchantment allows a save (rather than auto-deflecting like the feat), why not upgrade to the equivalent of Infinite Deflection, but with a save for every attack?

wO-_-OdrOw

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Re: Jedi Combat Forms via DnD 3.5
« Reply #11 on: August 04, 2011, 01:37:53 AM »
Dope! Rtfp  :banghead

You might consider spells, powers, chakras, invocations, vestiges, maneuvers and stances, etc that add to those styles. If there is a reason you are limiting to feats, I understand, but for the sake of really capturing the style, a wider variety of sources usually leads to a more faithful portrayal.
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dark_samuari

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Re: Jedi Combat Forms via DnD 3.5
« Reply #12 on: August 04, 2011, 01:46:27 AM »
The best way to represent a Lightsaber in 3.5 would be some variation of the Lantern Archon light ray.
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/archon.htm#lanternArchon

Specifically the bit about overcoming all DR. But, on to the feats... Form 3 mentions deflecting blows, but i don't see Deflect Arrows there. I think it'd be a better fit, only instead of deflecting by hand, you bat it with your sword.  The others seem spot on.

I think the reason I avoided giving Form 3 the Deflect Arrows feat was that the lightsaber already possess that ability (via the Deflecting enchantment) so it just seemed to be redundant to a degree.

Since your Deflection enchantment allows a save (rather than auto-deflecting like the feat), why not upgrade to the equivalent of Infinite Deflection, but with a save for every attack?

Hmm... May be a bit difficult with them being epic feats but there are some characters who I foresee using some of the easier to obtain epic feats (like our favorite, venerable dragonwrought kobold who speaks weirdly). There is also an element of homebrewing the epic feat into a lesser version (which I am trying to abstain away from).   

Dope! Rtfp  :banghead

You might consider spells, powers, chakras, invocations, vestiges, maneuvers and stances, etc that add to those styles. If there is a reason you are limiting to feats, I understand, but for the sake of really capturing the style, a wider variety of sources usually leads to a more faithful portrayal.

I do plan on utilizing maneuvers and stances as to enhance each style but I felt constructing the basic elements of the combat styles through feats represented a character's dedication towards a specific one while also keeping them more simplistic to a way. ToB is going to be a great resource when used on conjunction with them but I wanted the combat styles to be a bit independent from maneuvers & stances (as well as to have a tier system in them: beginner, advanced, master).