Author Topic: I have an idea... A cheesy idea.  (Read 2673 times)

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brujon

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I have an idea... A cheesy idea.
« on: August 03, 2011, 06:30:09 AM »
Travel devotion feat allows you to move up to your speed as a swift action. Pounce gets full attack on a charge. Battle jump makes you charge if you jump down on your target at least 5 ft. Jumping requires NO ACTION, and is instead part of a move action, which you can take as a swift action. Ruby Knight Vindicator gives us swift actions as long as we have turn undead attempts. Footsteps of the Divine, Persisted, gives us MAD, MAD speed. With that mad speed, we can get a lot of full attacks. A lot.

But Ruby Knight Vindictor requires your deity to be Wee Jas, and that doesn't grant you Travel Domain. So you can't get Travel Devotion. How can we get over that little quirk? 1 level of Seeker of Misty Isle (Sadly, that requires you to be an elf or half elf. Other requirements are easy.

What's the most efficient build to mish-mash this togheter? And how to improve on it with other classes?

Solo

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Re: I have an idea... A cheesy idea.
« Reply #1 on: August 03, 2011, 06:54:53 AM »
You can just take the Travel Devotion feat, it's not that hard.

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Esgath

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Re: I have an idea... A cheesy idea.
« Reply #2 on: August 03, 2011, 07:03:04 AM »
Footsteps of the Divine, Persisted, gives us MAD, MAD speed.

Footsteps of the Divine can't be persisted, because the spell can be discharged and thus doesn't qualify for Persist Spell.

Shiki

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Re: I have an idea... A cheesy idea.
« Reply #3 on: August 03, 2011, 07:06:21 AM »
Persistent FotD doesn't work as per an errata, IIRR.

That interpretation of Battle Jump gets hated on by some people and is apparently TO. I don't really get why.

Yes, RKV gets a stupidly OP ability; messing up w/ the action economy goes a long way.
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Mixster

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Re: I have an idea... A cheesy idea.
« Reply #4 on: August 03, 2011, 11:05:31 AM »
Remember that you need a good deal of turning for this to work. 7 For persisting your movement spell, +some for activating travel devotion + some for extra swift actions.

You'd need to be able to use elemental domains, and that wont work with Wee Jas as your god.
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Bard

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Re: I have an idea... A cheesy idea.
« Reply #5 on: August 03, 2011, 12:08:30 PM »
You could always us the adaptation chapter of the RKV. It doesn't HAVE TO follow Wee Jas, that's just the "premade example", pretty much as Radiant Servant of Pelor doesn't have to follow pelor.
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KellKheraptis

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Re: I have an idea... A cheesy idea.
« Reply #6 on: August 03, 2011, 12:46:00 PM »
Bear in mind, with the right 3 levels of the right notoriously powerful PrC, anything is Persistable.
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Esgath

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Re: I have an idea... A cheesy idea.
« Reply #7 on: August 03, 2011, 01:07:08 PM »
What was the argument again, that an Incantatrix doesn't care about the limitations?

Rebel7284

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Re: I have an idea... A cheesy idea.
« Reply #8 on: August 03, 2011, 01:47:47 PM »
What was the argument again, that an Incantatrix doesn't care about the limitations?

As I recall, Incantatrix uses the wording "existing spell effect." to persist ongoing spells as one of its abilities. This is a bit vague to some people as generally metamagic is applied during preparation or casting and checks things like range/legality then.

My interpretation is that spell effect is exactly that - an effect of a spell - and the ability still looks at the spell description to figure out if the spell could normally be affected by the metamagic feat.

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brujon

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Re: I have an idea... A cheesy idea.
« Reply #9 on: August 03, 2011, 03:11:11 PM »
Footsteps of the Divine, Persisted, gives us MAD, MAD speed.

Footsteps of the Divine can't be persisted, because the spell can be discharged and thus doesn't qualify for Persist Spell.

There's a pretty solid case to make for Footsteps of the Divine being persistable. There are 18 dischargable spells in Complete Champion, all of them have that on their statistics block, Footsteps doesn't. Also, you don't *discharge* the spell, but merely reduce it's duration to 1 round, and gain bonuses based on how many rounds are left. But that's gone with the errata...

Damn ;/ Even then, it's still a pretty solid spell if you Extend it with a high CL, thus offsetting the penalty of selecting an ability other than the ability of your deity. Or if you reflavor RKV as was suggested, you could just ditch Wee Jas and the level of seeker of misty isle, and have Fharlagn as your god. This grants you the Travel Domain, which you can then drop for the Travel Devotion feat as a cloistered cleric.

Turning attempts aren't that hard to get, via Nightsticks and multiple Extra Turnings. The main thing about this build is, each time you jump over an opponent (requiring 10ft high jump for a medim opponent), you gain a full attack. The higher we get our land speed, the more jumping and the more attacking. Continuous item of Expeditious Retreat, other stuff that adds land speed, etc...

How can we get this to work?

SorO_Lost

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Re: I have an idea... A cheesy idea.
« Reply #10 on: August 03, 2011, 06:06:44 PM »
I had a RVK spending turn attempts to regain swift actions and rapidly burning an Anklet of Translational to fall on someone some example some where.

Hmm... I also recall my omfg TO thing where I used Up the Walls and a Run Action with a high land speed character to rapidly run up a wall and free action fall and repeat till out of speed to charge multiple times at level 1.

Travel Devotion is a nice way to mix things up though.
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brujon

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Re: I have an idea... A cheesy idea.
« Reply #11 on: August 03, 2011, 08:23:35 PM »
Anklet of Translocation wouldn't work because it's only 2/day teleport without error 10ft. Up The Walls and free action falling could work, though. You'd only need Wis 13 and 1 rank of Autohypnosis and 1 PP. So it boils down to upping land speed, so you can run up a wall, free fall, and repeat. A tree counts as wall right? So you can use Quall's Feather Token to create a scalable wall anywhere. Let's optimize this!

brujon

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Re: I have an idea... A cheesy idea.
« Reply #12 on: August 03, 2011, 08:24:57 PM »
What was the argument again, that an Incantatrix doesn't care about the limitations?

As I recall, Incantatrix uses the wording "existing spell effect." to persist ongoing spells as one of its abilities. This is a bit vague to some people as generally metamagic is applied during preparation or casting and checks things like range/legality then.

My interpretation is that spell effect is exactly that - an effect of a spell - and the ability still looks at the spell description to figure out if the spell could normally be affected by the metamagic feat.



If we are to use this interpretation, things go to the realm of TO. I'd really wish we could make this at a pratical optimization level.

SorO_Lost

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Re: I have an idea... A cheesy idea.
« Reply #13 on: August 04, 2011, 12:04:28 AM »
Anklet of Translocation wouldn't work because it's only 2/day teleport without error 10ft. Up The Walls and free action falling could work, though. You'd only need Wis 13 and 1 rank of Autohypnosis and 1 PP. So it boils down to upping land speed, so you can run up a wall, free fall, and repeat. A tree counts as wall right? So you can use Quall's Feather Token to create a scalable wall anywhere. Let's optimize this!
Custom merged Anklets worked. The example I spoke of did something like 15 extra charges in a single round if needed. The protional is enough to cake walk though your encounters for the day.

Autohypnosis can be picked up as a Cross Class skill and any psionic race gives you 2 PP. With Flaws you can pick up Run & Up The Walls and still have a feat to spare.
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[spoiler]Tiers break down into who has spellcasting more than anything else due to spells being better than anything else in the game.
6: Skill based. Commoner, Expert, Samurai.
5: Mundane warrior. Barbarian, Fighter, Monk.
4: Partial casters. Adapt, Hexblade, Paladin, Ranger, Spelltheif.
3: Focused casters. Bard, Beguiler, Dread Necromancer, Martial Adapts, Warmage.
2: Full casters. Favored Soul, Psion, Sorcerer, Wu Jen.
1: Elitists. Artificer, Cleric, Druid, Wizard.
0: Gods. StP Erudite, Illthid Savant, Pun-Pun, Rocks fall & you die.
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Caelic

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Re: I have an idea... A cheesy idea.
« Reply #14 on: August 11, 2011, 05:53:17 PM »

You'd need to be able to use elemental domains, and that wont work with Wee Jas as your god.


Elemental domain turning doesn't work for purposes of divine feats; they specify turn undead.