Author Topic: I was bored, so...  (Read 2236 times)

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Amechra

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I was bored, so...
« on: May 25, 2011, 10:44:44 PM »
Just as a question, what's the best way to get Shadowcraft Mage cheese from a Paladin base?

I'm just asking because of, well, Battle Blessing and Sword of the Arcane Order. Plus, a level dip into Contemplative will supply the Luck Domain. I already am pretty sure on how I'll actually use the Shadow Miracle (Hint: Look at Ghostwalk.)

I'm actually thinking this would end up with a more Gishy Killer Gnome.

Plus, I am BORED, so...
[spoiler]Fighter: "I can kill a guy in one turn."
Cleric: "I can kill a guy in half a turn."
Wizard: "I can kill a guy before my turn."
Bard: "I can get three idiots to kill guys for me."

On a strange note, would anyone be put out if we had a post about people or events we can spare a thought for, or if its within their creed, a prayer for? Just a random thought, but ... hells I wouldn't have known about either Archangels daughter or Saeomons niece if I didn't happen to be on these threads.
Sounds fine to me.
probably over on "Off-topic".
might want to put a little disclaimer in the first post.

This is the Min/Max board. We should be able to figure out a way to optimize the POWER OF PRAYER(TM) that doesn't involve "Pazuzu, Pazuzu, Pazuzu".
[/spoiler]

My final project for my film independent study course. It could do with a watching and critiquing

X-Codes

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Re: I was bored, so...
« Reply #1 on: May 26, 2011, 01:55:23 AM »
Sword of the Arcane Order and DMM: Heighten together satisfy the spellcasting requirement.

EDIT: That is, unless your DM says that spells cast through Sword of the Arcane Order are Arcane, in which case you can't heighten them with DMM: Heighten.  In that case, be Illumian.

rot42

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Re: I was bored, so...
« Reply #2 on: May 26, 2011, 03:08:28 AM »
Cleric 6/Prestige Paladin 1/Shadowcraft Mage X fits nicely except for needing a fourth level or higher Illusion (Shadow) spell; probably some domain fulfills this. Archivist can work the same if you are willing to take the levels out of order; Shadow Conjuration is Divine Bard 4 if you are willing to go there. I am getting a mental image of an order of traveling librarians who go full Reading Rainbow with a partially-real shadow play on reaching town. The Paladin's mount would be refluffed as a mystical beast of burden tasked with ensuring the safety of the books in extremis.

Amechra

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Re: I was bored, so...
« Reply #3 on: May 26, 2011, 03:19:06 AM »
Only problem with that build is that it requires the DM to rule that Prestige Paladin levels count for SotAO; I'm essentially asking, "How cheezy can I make a caster based of a Paladin casting base, with NO OTHER CASTING?"

Turns out, if a minor reflavoring of a feat (swap from a god of magic from Ghostwalk to Mystra) is allowed, you can cast Shadow Miracles (The Circle Magic feat from Ghostwalk is basically a lite version of Circle Magic, in that it only goes up to SL 9 and CL 20.)
[spoiler]Fighter: "I can kill a guy in one turn."
Cleric: "I can kill a guy in half a turn."
Wizard: "I can kill a guy before my turn."
Bard: "I can get three idiots to kill guys for me."

On a strange note, would anyone be put out if we had a post about people or events we can spare a thought for, or if its within their creed, a prayer for? Just a random thought, but ... hells I wouldn't have known about either Archangels daughter or Saeomons niece if I didn't happen to be on these threads.
Sounds fine to me.
probably over on "Off-topic".
might want to put a little disclaimer in the first post.

This is the Min/Max board. We should be able to figure out a way to optimize the POWER OF PRAYER(TM) that doesn't involve "Pazuzu, Pazuzu, Pazuzu".
[/spoiler]

My final project for my film independent study course. It could do with a watching and critiquing

Unbeliever

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Re: I was bored, so...
« Reply #4 on: May 26, 2011, 03:35:16 AM »
Only problem with that build is that it requires the DM to rule that Prestige Paladin levels count for SotAO; I'm essentially asking, "How cheezy can I make a caster based of a Paladin casting base, with NO OTHER CASTING?"
...
But wouldn't you have so few spells per day that it'd hardly be worth it?  That would make Prestige Paladin or something like that (ur-priest, maybe?) much more attractive. 

Also, how many gishy SCM effects are there out there?  I guess it doesn't matter if you're aiming for Miracle anyway, though.  And, it's certainly a great "fall back" option ...

Amechra

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Re: I was bored, so...
« Reply #5 on: May 26, 2011, 04:33:54 AM »
Only problem with that build is that it requires the DM to rule that Prestige Paladin levels count for SotAO; I'm essentially asking, "How cheezy can I make a caster based of a Paladin casting base, with NO OTHER CASTING?"
...
But wouldn't you have so few spells per day that it'd hardly be worth it?  That would make Prestige Paladin or something like that (ur-priest, maybe?) much more attractive. 

Also, how many gishy SCM effects are there out there?  I guess it doesn't matter if you're aiming for Miracle anyway, though.  And, it's certainly a great "fall back" option ...

Fun Fact- Any day you need more than ten miracles is a very bad, and very rare day.
[spoiler]Fighter: "I can kill a guy in one turn."
Cleric: "I can kill a guy in half a turn."
Wizard: "I can kill a guy before my turn."
Bard: "I can get three idiots to kill guys for me."

On a strange note, would anyone be put out if we had a post about people or events we can spare a thought for, or if its within their creed, a prayer for? Just a random thought, but ... hells I wouldn't have known about either Archangels daughter or Saeomons niece if I didn't happen to be on these threads.
Sounds fine to me.
probably over on "Off-topic".
might want to put a little disclaimer in the first post.

This is the Min/Max board. We should be able to figure out a way to optimize the POWER OF PRAYER(TM) that doesn't involve "Pazuzu, Pazuzu, Pazuzu".
[/spoiler]

My final project for my film independent study course. It could do with a watching and critiquing

rot42

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Re: I was bored, so...
« Reply #6 on: May 27, 2011, 07:35:14 AM »
For the sake of completeness: I found the Shadow Domain in Eberron Campaign Setting that gives Shadow Conjuration as a fourth level spell. Also, my proposal above fails to account for needing four levels of Paladin to qualify for SotAO (so lose two caster levels for four levels of Prestige Paladin).

Ur-Priest gets the spells, but requires forsaking one's old deity. Their spells are probably not Paladin spells for purposes of Battle Blessing.

Where are you getting ninth level spell slots on a Paladin chassis? Just from Heighten + Earth Spell + Circle Magic (and two cohorts and an hour per Miracle), or have I missed a really cool thread?
« Last Edit: May 27, 2011, 07:40:23 AM by rot42 »

KellKheraptis

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Re: I was bored, so...
« Reply #7 on: May 27, 2011, 10:18:29 AM »
Quick and dirty build : Cloistered Cleric 4/Church Inquisitor 3/Shadowcraft Mage 4/Prestige Paladin 4/Divine Abjurant Champion 5

Gets 18/20 CL, 20/20 with divine power.  Oh yeah, and in addition to a toggle switch quicken, auto-extend on all shadow illusions and abjurations, and auto-quicken on all level 3 and under abjurations, along with absolutely bad ass AC buffs.

Another : Archivist 6/Spelldancer 1/Prestige Paladin 4/Shadowcraft Mage 5/Divine Oracle 4

18/20 CL again, only this time we've got workable Evasion in heavy armor, the same autoquicken from Battle Blessing, a damn good excuse to get the REST of the Sor/Wiz list with ease, Shadow Miracles, Ex Uncanny Dodge, Oracle domain, and if you want, drop the 5th level of SCM for a level in Church Inquisitor to pick up Inquisition domain as well.  This guy has access to literally every spell in the game, and an easier time getting them, plus his casting stat for both SotAO spells and his own native list are one and the same, and last but not least, as his base list is Cleric, he can also snag Initiate of Mystra, in a way becoming a supercharged Colossal War Cheater of Mystra hybrid.

EDIT : Working on an RKV build as well, before talking my daughter to school.

Crusader 3/Cleric 2/Ur-Priest of Mystral 1/Prestige Paladin 4/Shadowcraft Mage 3/Ruby Knight Vindicator 7
-Mystral's portfolio was taken over by Mystra, allowing Initiate of Mystra
-All the usual action economy breakers of an RKV with autoquickened spells on an SCM base
-Decent Caster Level, as most things count twice for calculating
-IL of 15, so you even get an 8th level maneuver
« Last Edit: May 27, 2011, 10:36:06 AM by KellKheraptis »
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