Author Topic: QUESTION: Shadowcraft Mage / "early" PrC adoption / not using Earth Spell  (Read 2844 times)

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proclus

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I've always chafed at the fact that you have to take Earth Sense to get to Earth Spell.

And I don't like the Earth Spell requirement that your two little gnomish feet must be touching god's green earth for it to work.

Also, I'd prefer to enter the PrC following 5th level via the "cast a 3rd level shadow spell heightened to 4th level, via earth spell-heighten spell" trick rather than following 7th level as usual.

My question is this:  given that your DM allows the Easy Metamagic feat from Dragon Magazine, why not just take Heighten spell as your 3rd level feat & Easy Metamagic (Heighten Spell) as your 5th level feat, and use that feat combo to cast a 3rd level shadow descriptor spell heightened to 4th level, but still in your 3rd level slot, thus meeting the PrC entrance requirements?

Why go the 2 feat Earth Sense -> Earth Spell route at all?
« Last Edit: April 26, 2011, 04:48:15 PM by proclus »

DrPhro

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Because then you'd need to be able to cast 4th lvl spells. Earth spell doesn't require that; it just says that a heightened spell is treated as a spell of 1 lvl higher. It's also really important later on, because you're only allowed to cast conj/evoc spells of 1 lvl lower than than the spell lvl, so you need to use the earth spell trick to cast 10th lvl spells pre-epic in order to mimic spells of 9th lvl. This becomes even more important if you take arcane disciple (luck) to get miracle, which is a 9th lvl spell.

proclus

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Because then you'd need to be able to cast 4th lvl spells. Earth spell doesn't require that; it just says that a heightened spell is treated as a spell of 1 lvl higher. It's also really important later on, because you're only allowed to cast conj/evoc spells of 1 lvl lower than than the spell lvl, so you need to use the earth spell trick to cast 10th lvl spells pre-epic in order to mimic spells of 9th lvl. This becomes even more important if you take arcane disciple (luck) to get miracle, which is a 9th lvl spell.

Assume that I am a 5th level wizard with the Heighten Spell feat, and the Easy Metamagic (Heighten Spell) feat.

By my understanding, I can use heighten spell feat to take a 1st level shadow descriptor spell to 4th level, which would normally require a 4th level spell slot, but still cast it with my 3rd level spell slot thanks to easy metamagic.

Thus I am "able to cast" 4th level spells as a 5th level character and meet the prereqs for the PrC.

Is this not accurate?

 
« Last Edit: April 27, 2011, 02:03:19 AM by proclus »

DrPhro

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You can only heighten a spell to a lvl that you can cast.

proclus

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You can only heighten a spell to a lvl that you can cast.

I see. :(

Thanks!

Bozwevial

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As for the Earth Spell requirement, just stuff your boots with earth and/or pebbles.

CrimsonDeath

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I've seen people claim that Heighten Spell + Versatile Spellcaster allows early entry.  I've also seen someone claim that Heighten Spell + Metamagic School Focus allows SCM entry at level 3 (on the grounds that the "three times per day" is not specified as applying to three different spells).  Seems like TO to me.

DrPhro

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Earth sense isn't that bad, since it's one of the easier/more reliable ways to keep from getting ambushed by invisible people at lower lvls.

X-Codes

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Earth sense isn't that bad, since it's one of the easier/more reliable ways to keep from getting ambushed by invisible people at lower lvls.
Not ambushed.  Can easily move and attack from more than 20' away, even at low levels.

For the purpose of tracking down invisible enemies you've already engaged with, however, it is useful.

As for early entry tricks, Earth Spell gets you in early, as does DMM: Heighten or Naenhoon, since the latter two effectively replace the adjustment instead of reducing it.  More general metamagic reducers, however, are questionable (at best) as to whether or not they work with Heighten Spell at all because of the strange way the feat is worded.  So, if you Heighten a cantrip to 1st-level with those 3 metamagic reductions from Metamagic School Focus, the reading of the feat suggests that it might still only count as a 1st-level spell.  That's why people tend to favor Earth Spell, DMM: Heighten, and Naenhoon over Metamagic School Focus (in fact, the only person I *ever* see touting Metamagic School Focus is Endarire).

Kajhera

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My DM's let me get in with metamagic school focus as one component, so it's not TO so much as probably an incorrect rules reading.  :)

Endarire

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I agree that Metamagic School Focus lets you fill the spell prereqs, letting you enter at L2 if you can meet the other prereqs.
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Speaking of which:
Don't even need TO for this.  Any decent Hood build, especially one with Celerity, one-rounds [Azathoth, the most powerful greater deity from d20 Cthulu].
Does it bug anyone else that we've reached the point where characters who can obliterate a greater deity in one round are considered "decent?"