so is there a reason a Warshaper can't...

[turok124]

use morphic weapon ability multiple times to increase a natural weapon's damage by multiple sizes?

i just figure if someone can have 12 tentacles...why not 12 tentacles that do 12d6 damage?

[Necrosnoop110]

The way I read things Morphic Weapons (Su) allows a Warshaper to amplify the damage of one type of natural weapon one time. Such that it would effect all natural weapons of that type.

Using Morphic Weapons on natural weapon type "claws" on a two handed Warshaper that already has two claws would up the damage on all his claw attacks not just a single claw. Therefore, using Morphic Weapons on the natural weapon type "tentacle" on a Warshaper that already has tentacles would up the damage on all his tentacle attacks not just a single tentacle.

However, you could not use Morphic Weapons on more than one type of natural weapons simultaneously, such as claws & bite or gore & tentacle at the same time. You also cannot stack multiple uses of Morphic Weapons on the same natural weapon type, i.e. the Morphic Weapons ability only increases the damage one time. Hope this answers what you were asking.  

Peace,
Necro  

[turok124]

well, we've talked about using morphic weapons multiple times to grow multiple weapons (ie...3 move actions to grow 3 tentacles).  my thought process was that if you could use the ability multiple times in THAT fashion, why couldn't you use it multiple times in the OTHER way (3 move actions to bump the damage 3 sizes)

[zook1shoe]

i think that's because the ability doesn't say you can increase the damage of a natural attack, just grow a new natural attack.

[turok124]

i think that's because the ability doesn't say you can increase the damage of a natural attack, just grow a new natural attack.

read it again.

[Widow]

It does not say you can't, but it may fall under the rules of not stacking bonuses from the same source.  I need to go over those again because I thought they were specially in the spell section, but they are often quoted in regards to magic items and class abilities.

[turok124]

It does not say you can't, but it may fall under the rules of not stacking bonuses from the same source.  I need to go over those again because I thought they were specially in the spell section, but they are often quoted in regards to magic items and class abilities.

that was my thinking exactly.  though i was afraid of going under the reasoning of "the rules don't say i can't"

[zook1shoe]

i think that's because the ability doesn't say you can increase the damage of a natural attack, just grow a new natural attack.

read it again.

right.... sorry was going from memory and forgot that part.

but i agree about the "not stacking from the same source" argument

[tealjohn]

after reading the text a coupe times I'd be willing to say that a warshaper can't grow weapons then enlarge them; mainly because it states that the warshaper's form must already have the weapon types.

[Necrosnoop110]

Morphic Weapons allows a Warshaper to do one of two things:

(1) Grow natural weapons as a move action. The Warshaper need not already possess those natural weapons.

(2) Amplify the damage dealt by a natural weapon type that the Warshaper already possesses up by one size category.

So a medium human Warshaper could polymorph into an Orc (which does not have natural claw attacks) and then (1) grow claws that have a base damage of 1d4
OR
a medium human Warshaper could polymorph into a Troglodyte and (2) amplify the damage of the Trodlodyte's medium claws up the next size category, going from 1d4 up to 1d6


What one cannot do, in the above example, is polymorph into an Orc, give it claw attacks it does not already possess and then increase the damage category up a size.

You can either grow natural weapons that are not there already or amplify natural attacks that are there already, you cannot do both.   

Peace,
Necro   

     

[Emo_Duck]

Can the warshaper amplify damage from natural weapons gained from a spell or power (such as a Psychic Warrior's 'Claws of the Beast')? I figure the rules allow for it, though it seems iffy fluff-wise.

[CrimsonDeath]

Since it works just fine for natural weapons granted by the Polymorph spell, it seems directly in line with the fluff to me.

[Necrosnoop110]

Can the warshaper amplify damage from natural weapons gained from a spell or power (such as a Psychic Warrior's 'Claws of the Beast')? I figure the rules allow for it, though it seems iffy fluff-wise.

I would rule that they could. The letter of the rule is that the Warshaper's "class features function only when the warshaper is in a form other than her own." So I guess if you want to get technical the question becomes, does it have to be a completely different change in form (e.g. polymorph) or is a partial form change (e.g. Claws of the Beast) enough? An argument could be made either way but since there is no clear definition in D&D 3.5 of what exactly "form" means, at least not any formal definition I've ever found, as a DM I would favor allowing it. Even if it breaks slightly from RAW (Rules As Written) it doesn't seem overpowered or outside of the RAI (Rules As Intended) to allow it to work that way, IMHO.   

Peace,
Necro

[DrPhro]

On the surface this seems like a poorly worded ability, but I think that it actually covers itself.  It says that any natural weapon you already had deals damage as if it were one size category larger. So it doesn't say that you can take a move action to increase the size of a weapon you already had, it just automatically increases. I think that the first part of the ability can't get NI weapons because it mutually disqualifies you from the first ability by qualifying you for the second though you don't get the benefits of the second because you don't meet it's prerequisites.

So if I polymorph into a bear I take a move action to grow a gore attack, because I now already have a gore attack I can't grow another, but because I didn't already have a gore attack it doesn't grow in size. Also my claws now deal 2d6.

Now I agree that you can still grow a tail, a wing, a sting, a bite, a tentacle, and maybe even a slam attack, but anyone who is going to listen to me probably wouldn't do that anyways.

But who knows, maybe I'm just full of it.

[nijineko]

i was once musing the prospect of a warshaper lasher who uses hair for a whip... and was debating whether they good grow out or retract the hair at will. considering that most entries into warshaper allow the user to control minor characteristics within normal limits for the species, and hair can get quite long, even in humans... combine that with the morphic reach, and morphic healing, and i'm half convinced that it could work. maybe get a hairpiece of animate rope for better control at need.

of course, this was the first thing i thought of after seeing the recent "tangled" movie.... (eyeroll at self)