Author Topic: Suggest a Vestige to go with Zceryll!  (Read 7651 times)

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KellKheraptis

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Suggest a Vestige to go with Zceryll!
« on: April 22, 2011, 04:44:11 PM »
On a psionically adapted Anima Mage with an Erudite base using bloodlines (so up to 6th level).  Dantallion seems intriguing due to the constant detect thoughts coupled with telepathy and mindsight, though there might be better available.  Any ideas?
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Shadowhunter

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Re: Suggest a Vestige to go with Zceryll!
« Reply #1 on: April 22, 2011, 05:15:39 PM »
Since it's you Kell, might I suggest Naberius for the fast healing along with Body Fuel as a feat?
Whether or not it's entirely kosher I'm not sure. But it can be argued it's a natural healing process only acting a lot quicker.
That would mean a PP-recharge mechanic.
I wouldn't allow it personally, but you're a Black Hat so it's up your alley ;)
First thing that comes to mind, if I come up with something else I'll get back to you.
[Spoiler]
Quote from: Runestar
the most effective optimization is the one you can actually get away with.  :smirk

Quote from: Vinom
(A group of nerds are called a murder because like crows we are anti-social, like shiny things, and often squack at each other over nothing for hours)

I often have to remind people not to underrate divination.  The ability to effectively metagame without actually metagaming beats the ability to set things on fire more times than not.
[/quote]
[/spoiler]

Binder? You're Welcome

Zceryll makes Binders go from tier 3 to tier 2.
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Gnomeo

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Re: Suggest a Vestige to go with Zceryll!
« Reply #2 on: April 22, 2011, 05:31:04 PM »
You could bind one of the psionic vestiges (Arete or The Triad) for 13 or 15 free power points and access to a few minor powers each day.

Alternatively, if you ended up with an odd-numbered EBL (as with Binder 1 / Anima Mage 10) you could bind Ipos.  That would boost your EBL for Zceryll's abilities and provide you with the next level of Summon Monster.  The claws and rend are meh, but swift True Sight isn't bad.
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KellKheraptis

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Re: Suggest a Vestige to go with Zceryll!
« Reply #3 on: April 22, 2011, 05:46:58 PM »
Since it's you Kell, might I suggest Naberius for the fast healing along with Body Fuel as a feat?
Whether or not it's entirely kosher I'm not sure. But it can be argued it's a natural healing process only acting a lot quicker.
That would mean a PP-recharge mechanic.
I wouldn't allow it personally, but you're a Black Hat so it's up your alley ;)
First thing that comes to mind, if I come up with something else I'll get back to you.

Stellar idea, especially since PsyRef doesn't cost a thing with Supernatural Transformation.

You could bind one of the psionic vestiges (Arete or The Triad) for 13 or 15 free power points and access to a few minor powers each day.

Alternatively, if you ended up with an odd-numbered EBL (as with Binder 1 / Anima Mage 10) you could bind Ipos.  That would boost your EBL for Zceryll's abilities and provide you with the next level of Summon Monster.  The claws and rend are meh, but swift True Sight isn't bad.

Ipos has an EBL booster?  That'd be sweet...hello Summon Monster 8 for my guards...too bad I can't persist that.

EDIT : Also, paged through the first bits of the 339 vestige thread (184 pages...fawk!), and was wondering if anyone ever saw a Raistlin Majere vestige.  He'd seem like the penultimate capstone bind.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2011, 07:00:39 PM by KellKheraptis »
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Shadowhunter

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Re: Suggest a Vestige to go with Zceryll!
« Reply #4 on: April 22, 2011, 08:16:18 PM »
http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19539322/lets_make_some_new_vestiges?post_id=332055990#332055990

Quote

Personally, I think Raistlin should be like a 5th level vestige or something, at least.
[Spoiler]
Quote from: Runestar
the most effective optimization is the one you can actually get away with.  :smirk

Quote from: Vinom
(A group of nerds are called a murder because like crows we are anti-social, like shiny things, and often squack at each other over nothing for hours)

I often have to remind people not to underrate divination.  The ability to effectively metagame without actually metagaming beats the ability to set things on fire more times than not.
[/quote]
[/spoiler]

Binder? You're Welcome

Zceryll makes Binders go from tier 3 to tier 2.
Cagemarrow is a Genius

Before giving the advice that build X would be better of with Fist of the Forest, take a long, good look at Primal Living. Twice.

Havok4

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Re: Suggest a Vestige to go with Zceryll!
« Reply #5 on: April 22, 2011, 11:59:06 PM »
Haures is a very good choice and will give you access to illusions, something that psionic characters lack.

Cagemarrow

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Re: Suggest a Vestige to go with Zceryll!
« Reply #6 on: April 23, 2011, 12:38:55 AM »
I myself have had very good luck with zcerryll, naberius and haures. Major image that you don't have to concentrate on with summons who can hide in it can be devastating. I'm a big fan of using it to replicate a blindingly bright light, while telepathically telling the party it's an illusion. Full concealment for everyone! While looking like you're going into battle surrounded by holy radiance. Definitely looks good to the soldiers back on the wall of the town you're defending from hordes of hobgoblins.   :D

The mindsight mindblank fast ability healing and dazing ray certainly help, even managed to kill a dragon with the phantasmal killer when luck was on our side.

JohnnyMayHymn

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Re: Suggest a Vestige to go with Zceryll!
« Reply #7 on: April 23, 2011, 10:13:07 AM »
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CrimsonDeath

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Re: Suggest a Vestige to go with Zceryll!
« Reply #8 on: April 23, 2011, 08:23:36 PM »
Since it's you Kell, might I suggest Naberius for the fast healing along with Body Fuel as a feat?
I don't think that'll work.  Ability burn can't be healed naturally, and Fast Ability Healing is (Su).

BeholderSlayer

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Re: Suggest a Vestige to go with Zceryll!
« Reply #9 on: April 23, 2011, 09:01:35 PM »
Since it's you Kell, might I suggest Naberius for the fast healing along with Body Fuel as a feat?
I don't think that'll work.  Ability burn can't be healed naturally, and Fast Ability Healing is (Su).
If it can't be healed naturally, what makes you think it can't be healed SUPERnaturally?
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CrimsonDeath

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Re: Suggest a Vestige to go with Zceryll!
« Reply #10 on: April 24, 2011, 05:00:15 AM »
Since it's you Kell, might I suggest Naberius for the fast healing along with Body Fuel as a feat?
I don't think that'll work.  Ability burn can't be healed naturally, and Fast Ability Healing is (Su).
If it can't be healed naturally, what makes you think it can't be healed SUPERnaturally?
Mistyped.  I was apparently trying to say "can't be healed magically" and "can only be healed naturally" at the same time.

mthor

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Re: Suggest a Vestige to go with Zceryll!
« Reply #11 on: April 25, 2011, 02:01:04 AM »
Check out this guy Astaroth, Diabolus of Baator its http://www.scribd.com/doc/38835505/Tome-of-Magic-Additional-Vestige-Collection-v2-1-2 on page 10ish.
He's not for every day use but having an unlimited amount of divinations can either be useless or awesome depending on your DM.
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JaronK

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Re: Suggest a Vestige to go with Zceryll!
« Reply #12 on: April 25, 2011, 03:06:06 AM »
Check out this guy Astaroth, Diabolus of Baator its http://www.scribd.com/doc/38835505/Tome-of-Magic-Additional-Vestige-Collection-v2-1-2 on page 10ish.
He's not for every day use but having an unlimited amount of divinations can either be useless or awesome depending on your DM.

What is that collection?  It looks like a third party collection, but I recognize the second Astaroth as being an official vestige.  Is it just a collection of all vestiges outside of Tome of Magic?

Either way, it's certainly a potent vestige since it lets you craft all kinds of fun stuff.  And the other version of Astaroth... divination at will.  Damn.

JaronK

spacemonkey555

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Re: Suggest a Vestige to go with Zceryll!
« Reply #13 on: April 25, 2011, 04:38:11 AM »
Check the last page, it lists the sources

web enhancements and articles, Dungeon magazine, Dragon magazine, Dragon Magic sourcebook

Cagemarrow

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Re: Suggest a Vestige to go with Zceryll!
« Reply #14 on: April 25, 2011, 10:08:53 AM »
If you've gotten to EBL 14 you don't need Astaroth for the at will divinations anymore. The Movanic Deva from Summon monster VII gets Divination 3/day at CL 9 as well as Commune and for bonus sake Raise Dead 1/day as (Sp) abilities. Lots of other useful ones as well.

mthor

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Re: Suggest a Vestige to go with Zceryll!
« Reply #15 on: April 25, 2011, 09:55:39 PM »
If you've gotten to EBL 14 you don't need Astaroth for the at will divinations anymore. The Movanic Deva from Summon monster VII gets Divination 3/day at CL 9 as well as Commune and for bonus sake Raise Dead 1/day as (Sp) abilities. Lots of other useful ones as well.
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The god of thunder....... yeah I'm the hammer

Just ask yourself..... W.W.T.D  what would Thor do
mthor, look what you did. You made people on the internet argue. We all hate you with a fiery passion, now. :P

Phaenix

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Re: Suggest a Vestige to go with Zceryll!
« Reply #16 on: April 26, 2011, 01:03:36 AM »
If you've gotten to EBL 14 you don't need Astaroth for the at will divinations anymore. The Movanic Deva from Summon monster VII gets Divination 3/day at CL 9 as well as Commune and for bonus sake Raise Dead 1/day as (Sp) abilities. Lots of other useful ones as well.
Pics or it didn't happen....... I mean. Source?

Fiend Folio p. 57. The pic is also quite nice. ;)

mthor

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Re: Suggest a Vestige to go with Zceryll!
« Reply #17 on: April 26, 2011, 01:05:39 AM »
sweet.....
The god of thunder....... yeah I'm the hammer

Just ask yourself..... W.W.T.D  what would Thor do
mthor, look what you did. You made people on the internet argue. We all hate you with a fiery passion, now. :P

Shadowhunter

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Re: Suggest a Vestige to go with Zceryll!
« Reply #18 on: April 26, 2011, 05:18:10 AM »
Check out this guy Astaroth, Diabolus of Baator its http://www.scribd.com/doc/38835505/Tome-of-Magic-Additional-Vestige-Collection-v2-1-2 on page 10ish.
He's not for every day use but having an unlimited amount of divinations can either be useless or awesome depending on your DM.

What is that collection?  It looks like a third party collection, but I recognize the second Astaroth as being an official vestige.  Is it just a collection of all vestiges outside of Tome of Magic?

Either way, it's certainly a potent vestige since it lets you craft all kinds of fun stuff.  And the other version of Astaroth... divination at will.  Damn.

JaronK

I happened upon that collection a few years back by following an obscure link in someones sig back at "then-still-wizards" board.
So I figured I'd share the love with the people and put it up on Scribd.
It's also in my link, so that someone else can do the "fortious-stumble" as well.
I do love me some Binder action :D
[Spoiler]
Quote from: Runestar
the most effective optimization is the one you can actually get away with.  :smirk

Quote from: Vinom
(A group of nerds are called a murder because like crows we are anti-social, like shiny things, and often squack at each other over nothing for hours)

I often have to remind people not to underrate divination.  The ability to effectively metagame without actually metagaming beats the ability to set things on fire more times than not.
[/quote]
[/spoiler]

Binder? You're Welcome

Zceryll makes Binders go from tier 3 to tier 2.
Cagemarrow is a Genius

Before giving the advice that build X would be better of with Fist of the Forest, take a long, good look at Primal Living. Twice.

Cagemarrow

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Re: Suggest a Vestige to go with Zceryll!
« Reply #19 on: April 26, 2011, 10:47:44 AM »
Don't forget once you get to EBL 18 and can use Summon Monster 9 there are summons to get you an at will 9th level sorceror who can choose cleric spells or a 12 lvl wizard. :) (Coautal MMI, Ursinal Guardinal from BoED) With the right build you can get that at Character Lvl 14. (Blood lines +2, + Favored Vestige + Ipos)