Author Topic: COLD THEMED CASTER rebuild Advice: pathfinder / 3.5  (Read 17588 times)

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CrimsonDeath

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Re: COLD THEMED CASTER rebuild Advice: pathfinder / 3.5
« Reply #40 on: April 08, 2011, 11:20:46 PM »
Crimson was trying to follow up saying the nonlethal damage dealt to you via weather was in fact [Cold] based since it was from a cold source. Makes a lot of sense really. It just falls short of how the rules handle it.
That's actually exactly backwards from my line of reasoning.  From the way Frostburn describes Unearthly Cold environments, cold resistance reduces (or, in sufficient amounts, eliminates) the damage from a cold environment.  Since reducing cold damage is all and exactly what cold resistance does, that implies the damage is cold-typed.

Since you brought up Sandstorm, notice that fire resistance offers no protection factor against hot environments (below Burning, a.k.a. Fire Dominant) and, since nothing says otherwise, does precisely jack squat against the damage hot environments cause.  This implies that such damage is not fire damage and, since it's not explicitly described and nothing explicitly reduces it, we can infer that it is untyped (although it should be tracked separately from other damage, since it can't be healed until the character reaches a milder environment or achieves a stronger protection level).

SorO_Lost

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Re: COLD THEMED CASTER rebuild Advice: pathfinder / 3.5
« Reply #41 on: April 09, 2011, 06:17:46 PM »
Crimson was trying to follow up saying the nonlethal damage dealt to you via weather was in fact [Cold] based since it was from a cold source. Makes a lot of sense really. It just falls short of how the rules handle it.
Since reducing cold damage is all and exactly what cold resistance does, that implies the damage is cold-typed.
Did I not say it makes sense however it has problems with the rules.

Since you brought up Sandstorm, notice that fire resistance offers no protection factor against hot environments
Are you now? [Fire] is always subject to Resistance unless noted otherwise. The lack of inclusion on page 15 of course doesn't override the base. But hey if you can convince your DM of that go ahead.
Tiers explained in 8 sentences. With examples!
[spoiler]Tiers break down into who has spellcasting more than anything else due to spells being better than anything else in the game.
6: Skill based. Commoner, Expert, Samurai.
5: Mundane warrior. Barbarian, Fighter, Monk.
4: Partial casters. Adapt, Hexblade, Paladin, Ranger, Spelltheif.
3: Focused casters. Bard, Beguiler, Dread Necromancer, Martial Adapts, Warmage.
2: Full casters. Favored Soul, Psion, Sorcerer, Wu Jen.
1: Elitists. Artificer, Cleric, Druid, Wizard.
0: Gods. StP Erudite, Illthid Savant, Pun-Pun, Rocks fall & you die.
[/spoiler]

McPoyo

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Re: COLD THEMED CASTER rebuild Advice: pathfinder / 3.5
« Reply #42 on: April 09, 2011, 07:26:00 PM »
Damage from an untyped source that gets included is different than damage from an untyped source. Nowhere is the nonlethal damage given the fire or cold types, cold environment nonlethal damage just gets special treatment. Cold lethal damage from a cold environment exposure comes in at a very low temperature, below that of freezing, is the point. Ergo, things that deal lethal cold damage must also have an effect that is at least that low in temperature.
[Spoiler]
A gygaxian dungeon is like the world's most messed up game show.

Behind door number one: INSTANT DEATH!
Behind door number 2: A magic crown!
Behind door number 3: 4d6 giant bees, and THREE HUNDRED POUNDS OF HONEY!
They don't/haven't, was the point. 3.5 is as dead as people not liking nice tits.

Sometimes, their tits (3.5) get enhancements (houserules), but that doesn't mean people don't like nice tits.

Though sometimes, the surgeon (DM) botches them pretty bad...
Best metaphor I have seen in a long time.  I give you much fu.
Three Errata for the Mage-kings under the sky,
Seven for the Barbarian-lords in their halls of stone,
Nine for Mortal Monks doomed to die,
One for the Wizard on his dark throne
In the Land of Charop where the Shadows lie.
[/spoiler]

Littha

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Re: COLD THEMED CASTER rebuild Advice: pathfinder / 3.5
« Reply #43 on: April 09, 2011, 07:31:54 PM »

McPoyo

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Re: COLD THEMED CASTER rebuild Advice: pathfinder / 3.5
« Reply #44 on: April 09, 2011, 07:37:28 PM »
Hence why I mentioned ice causing Ray of Frost last page, which got ignored.
[Spoiler]
A gygaxian dungeon is like the world's most messed up game show.

Behind door number one: INSTANT DEATH!
Behind door number 2: A magic crown!
Behind door number 3: 4d6 giant bees, and THREE HUNDRED POUNDS OF HONEY!
They don't/haven't, was the point. 3.5 is as dead as people not liking nice tits.

Sometimes, their tits (3.5) get enhancements (houserules), but that doesn't mean people don't like nice tits.

Though sometimes, the surgeon (DM) botches them pretty bad...
Best metaphor I have seen in a long time.  I give you much fu.
Three Errata for the Mage-kings under the sky,
Seven for the Barbarian-lords in their halls of stone,
Nine for Mortal Monks doomed to die,
One for the Wizard on his dark throne
In the Land of Charop where the Shadows lie.
[/spoiler]

SorO_Lost

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Re: COLD THEMED CASTER rebuild Advice: pathfinder / 3.5
« Reply #45 on: April 10, 2011, 04:22:27 PM »
Hell I thought this was all started based on the concept ice is supposed to be rare or not. [Cold] being cold was simply the best one to argue about and we were all bored anyway.

People like drama you know :)
Tiers explained in 8 sentences. With examples!
[spoiler]Tiers break down into who has spellcasting more than anything else due to spells being better than anything else in the game.
6: Skill based. Commoner, Expert, Samurai.
5: Mundane warrior. Barbarian, Fighter, Monk.
4: Partial casters. Adapt, Hexblade, Paladin, Ranger, Spelltheif.
3: Focused casters. Bard, Beguiler, Dread Necromancer, Martial Adapts, Warmage.
2: Full casters. Favored Soul, Psion, Sorcerer, Wu Jen.
1: Elitists. Artificer, Cleric, Druid, Wizard.
0: Gods. StP Erudite, Illthid Savant, Pun-Pun, Rocks fall & you die.
[/spoiler]

CrimsonDeath

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Re: COLD THEMED CASTER rebuild Advice: pathfinder / 3.5
« Reply #46 on: April 10, 2011, 10:27:09 PM »
I was just arguing because someone was wrong on the internet.  I think I'm pretty much over it now though.

I hope the OP got something useful along the way...

SorO_Lost

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Re: COLD THEMED CASTER rebuild Advice: pathfinder / 3.5
« Reply #47 on: April 10, 2011, 11:47:03 PM »
I was just arguing because someone was wrong on the internet.  I think I'm pretty much over it now though.

I hope the OP got something useful along the way...
And I because I was right. :D

*cough* I mean lovely weather we're having eh? *cough*
Tiers explained in 8 sentences. With examples!
[spoiler]Tiers break down into who has spellcasting more than anything else due to spells being better than anything else in the game.
6: Skill based. Commoner, Expert, Samurai.
5: Mundane warrior. Barbarian, Fighter, Monk.
4: Partial casters. Adapt, Hexblade, Paladin, Ranger, Spelltheif.
3: Focused casters. Bard, Beguiler, Dread Necromancer, Martial Adapts, Warmage.
2: Full casters. Favored Soul, Psion, Sorcerer, Wu Jen.
1: Elitists. Artificer, Cleric, Druid, Wizard.
0: Gods. StP Erudite, Illthid Savant, Pun-Pun, Rocks fall & you die.
[/spoiler]

Caelic

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Re: COLD THEMED CASTER rebuild Advice: pathfinder / 3.5
« Reply #48 on: April 14, 2011, 07:32:11 PM »
Well, here's a solution that may or may not have been mentioned.  It's my preferred way to supply myself with snow.

1. Take a sealable, insulated metal box small enough to fit on your belt.  
2. Cast Darsson's Chilling Chamber on the inside of the box.
3. Fill the box with snow.


Voila--instant icebox.

Some really anal DMs might argue that you can't create a mobile area of effect with Darsson's, but given that producing an icebox is the explicit purpose of the spell, I think most reasonable DMs will let this fly.

If your DM is one of the aforementioned anal types, the process gets more expensive:

1. Take a large room and fill it with snow.
2. Cast Darsson's Chilling CHamber on the room.
3. Leave a Ring Gate in the room.
4. Carry the other Ring Gate with you.
5. Whenever you need snow, stick your hand into the Ring Gate and pull some out.
« Last Edit: April 14, 2011, 07:34:18 PM by Caelic »

SorO_Lost

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Re: COLD THEMED CASTER rebuild Advice: pathfinder / 3.5
« Reply #49 on: April 14, 2011, 07:35:41 PM »
<snip>
Use the extraplanar space backpack in core. The space never moves, and it's cheaper than ring gates.
Tiers explained in 8 sentences. With examples!
[spoiler]Tiers break down into who has spellcasting more than anything else due to spells being better than anything else in the game.
6: Skill based. Commoner, Expert, Samurai.
5: Mundane warrior. Barbarian, Fighter, Monk.
4: Partial casters. Adapt, Hexblade, Paladin, Ranger, Spelltheif.
3: Focused casters. Bard, Beguiler, Dread Necromancer, Martial Adapts, Warmage.
2: Full casters. Favored Soul, Psion, Sorcerer, Wu Jen.
1: Elitists. Artificer, Cleric, Druid, Wizard.
0: Gods. StP Erudite, Illthid Savant, Pun-Pun, Rocks fall & you die.
[/spoiler]

Caelic

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Re: COLD THEMED CASTER rebuild Advice: pathfinder / 3.5
« Reply #50 on: April 14, 2011, 08:01:34 PM »
<snip>
Use the extraplanar space backpack in core. The space never moves, and it's cheaper than ring gates.


Well, I'm figuring that any DM who was too anal to allow a simple portable icebox (despite that being what the spell was designed to do!) would probably also not allow the spell to be cast into an extradimensional space.   The ring gates approach is expensive, but there's really no way for a DM to refuse it short of "I don't want you to have nice things, so there."