Author Topic: It's Time To Duel  (Read 26223 times)

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X-Codes

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Re: It's Time To Duel
« Reply #40 on: April 18, 2011, 07:34:23 PM »
Probably the most ironic thing about this silly parody is that Solo is entirely correct with his monk/duelist build idea within the core rules, as I already outlined and suggested, long, long time ago in my still often misunderstood monk guide. :lmao

But if people had a good time reading this it already served its purpose - to entertain... :D

- Giacomo

PS: I'd probably do a level 11 monk/9th level duelist since with 11 monk levels plus INA and monk's belt you'll easily have 4d8 base plus 1d6 precise damage times up to 10 attacks/round plus other bonuses, but that's just me...possibly the undisputed master of core optimisation, carnivore, will have better combinations up his sleeve.
Like a 10th-level Wizard polymorphing into a 10-headed hydra.  This build is a complete joke, there really isn't anything of redeeming value about it.

Sir Giacomo

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Re: It's Time To Duel
« Reply #41 on: April 18, 2011, 07:51:06 PM »
Like a 10th-level Wizard polymorphing into a 10-headed hydra.  This build is a complete joke, there really isn't anything of redeeming value about it.

Well, Solo's build is not exactly finetuned (and that was not the purpose of it), but what is so bad about having AC in the 50s within the core rules environment?

- Giacomo

Lycanthromancer

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Re: It's Time To Duel
« Reply #42 on: April 18, 2011, 07:55:45 PM »
Like a 10th-level Wizard polymorphing into a 10-headed hydra.  This build is a complete joke, there really isn't anything of redeeming value about it.

Well, Solo's build is not exactly finetuned (and that was not the purpose of it), but what is so bad about having AC in the 50s within the core rules environment?

- Giacomo
Uh...the fact that past about level 5 AC no longer matters? I'd rather have a character who just doesn't care about dying than one who gets creamed because someone ignored that AC altogether and made you go splat because he has three or four dozen other ways to kill you?
[spoiler]Masculine men like masculine things. Masculine men are masculine. Therefore, liking masculine men is masculine.

I dare anyone to find a hole in that logic.
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Sir Giacomo

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Re: It's Time To Duel
« Reply #43 on: April 18, 2011, 08:04:31 PM »
Uh...the fact that past about level 5 AC no longer matters? I'd rather have a character who just doesn't care about dying than one who gets creamed because someone ignored that AC altogether and made you go splat because he has three or four dozen other ways to kill you?

Past level 5 AC no longer matters? Hmm. What about full attacking dragons? Pouncing chargers?
I wonder what you could mean. Even Solo suggested blink, so that's your miss chance (apart from the monk's quite good stealth skills that add concealment to the lot).
Then touch AC is also less of an issue with such a build.
Saves vs spell attacks maybe? Probably not with a monk.
No-spell-no-SR spell attacks maybe? Can all be countered/handled with the right equipment.
Hmmm.
What could it be from level 5 that makes AC redundant in core?

- Giacomo

PS: Note that while Solo made a laugh out of AC optimisation, even the build he outlined was able to do much, much more than just that.

Lycanthromancer

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Re: It's Time To Duel
« Reply #44 on: April 18, 2011, 08:07:04 PM »
Multiple miss-chances and immunities are better.
[spoiler]Masculine men like masculine things. Masculine men are masculine. Therefore, liking masculine men is masculine.

I dare anyone to find a hole in that logic.
______________________________________
[/spoiler]I'm a writer. These are my stories. Some are even SFW! (Warning: Mostly Gay.)
My awesome poster collection. (Warning, some are NSFW.)
Agita's awesome poster collection.
[spoiler]
+1 Lycanthromancer
Which book is Lycanthromancer in?
Lyca ... is in the book. Yes he is.
 :D
shit.. concerning psionics optimization, lycan IS the book
[/spoiler]

Sir Giacomo

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Re: It's Time To Duel
« Reply #45 on: April 18, 2011, 08:12:50 PM »
Multiple miss-chances and immunities are better.

I'm curious to see a build in core which can achieve this better than a monk/duelist (remember: relying purely on magic makes the build more vulnerable).

- Giacomo

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Re: It's time to Duel
« Reply #46 on: April 18, 2011, 08:27:49 PM »
Somebody call Giacomo !



I made a similar build for my wife in our current campaign. However ...

... Human or Strongheart Halfling ...


There's roleplaying  ;)
... and then there's nothing can touch my wife.
 ;)

You can't touch this. Oh Oh Oh-oh Oh, Oh Oh Oh Oh-oh. Stop.

Lycanthromancer

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Re: It's Time To Duel
« Reply #47 on: April 18, 2011, 08:58:46 PM »
Multiple miss-chances and immunities are better.

I'm curious to see a build in core which can achieve this better than a monk/duelist (remember: relying purely on magic makes the build more vulnerable).

- Giacomo
Okay, dude. This is ME we're talking about. Do you really want to go there?

Also, magic is by far the most powerful thing in D&D-land. It curbstomps pretty much EVERYTHING. Including divine ranks.
« Last Edit: April 18, 2011, 09:07:03 PM by Lycanthromancer »
[spoiler]Masculine men like masculine things. Masculine men are masculine. Therefore, liking masculine men is masculine.

I dare anyone to find a hole in that logic.
______________________________________
[/spoiler]I'm a writer. These are my stories. Some are even SFW! (Warning: Mostly Gay.)
My awesome poster collection. (Warning, some are NSFW.)
Agita's awesome poster collection.
[spoiler]
+1 Lycanthromancer
Which book is Lycanthromancer in?
Lyca ... is in the book. Yes he is.
 :D
shit.. concerning psionics optimization, lycan IS the book
[/spoiler]

Solo

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Re: It's Time To Duel
« Reply #48 on: April 18, 2011, 09:51:27 PM »
An AC of 50 at level 20 isn't going to do much vs a Balor who locks you down via Blasphemy. A Dragon who scares you away via a Fear aura or uses his 15th level sorcerer spellcasting attack you as if you were flatfooted (Improved Invisibility) and can detect you despite your Hide score with his Blindsense, or a Tarrasque which hits you on anything but a one due to its attack bonus of +57...

AC aside, there's no way to force an enemy to attack you so even if you're hittable, the enemy could still walk around you and attack your friends while you are unable to stop him.

You tell me, Giacomo, what does this build contribute in a party?


"I am the Black Mage! I cast the spells that makes the peoples fall down!"

The Legend RPG, which I worked on and encourage you to read.

Saxony

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Re: It's Time To Duel
« Reply #49 on: April 18, 2011, 09:55:38 PM »
Multiple miss-chances and immunities are better.

I'm curious to see a build in core which can achieve this better than a monk/duelist (remember: relying purely on magic makes the build more vulnerable).

- Giacomo
I have no idea why you would specifically call out magic as a liability.

Anything can be a liability depending on the group or the DM. Magic is just one of those things. It is only as much a liability as your group wants it to be.

Maybe with your group or at your table, magic is a liability. That's fine, and I'd like to see how that all plays out. With most groups, magic decreases net vulnerability.
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Solo

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Re: It's Time To Duel
« Reply #50 on: April 18, 2011, 09:58:23 PM »
Apparently magic is a liability because a monk who casts AMF on him with a scroll can walk up to you and negate it.

"I am the Black Mage! I cast the spells that makes the peoples fall down!"

The Legend RPG, which I worked on and encourage you to read.

Prime32

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Re: It's Time To Duel
« Reply #51 on: April 18, 2011, 10:07:39 PM »
Multiple miss-chances and immunities are better.

I'm curious to see a build in core which can achieve this better than a monk/duelist
At 20th-level? A group of twelve 13th-level wizards with blink, fly and mirror image, standing 10ft apart. Make them wizard 5/red wizard 8 if you want.
« Last Edit: April 18, 2011, 10:15:59 PM by Prime32 »
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The tier system in a nutshell:
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Tier 3: An expert marksman, cartographer and chef who can tie strong knots and is trained in hostage negotiation or a marksman so good he can shoot down every bullet fired by a minigun while armed with a rusted single-shot pistol that veers to the left.
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Tier 1: Someone with teleportation, mind control, time manipulation, intangibility, the ability to turn into an exact duplicate of anything and the ability to see into the future with perfect accuracy.[/spoiler]

Lycanthromancer

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Re: It's Time To Duel
« Reply #52 on: April 18, 2011, 10:10:00 PM »
Apparently magic is a liability because a monk who casts AMF on him with a scroll can walk up to you and negate it.
I can think of a LOT of ways to work around this, even Core-only.
[spoiler]Masculine men like masculine things. Masculine men are masculine. Therefore, liking masculine men is masculine.

I dare anyone to find a hole in that logic.
______________________________________
[/spoiler]I'm a writer. These are my stories. Some are even SFW! (Warning: Mostly Gay.)
My awesome poster collection. (Warning, some are NSFW.)
Agita's awesome poster collection.
[spoiler]
+1 Lycanthromancer
Which book is Lycanthromancer in?
Lyca ... is in the book. Yes he is.
 :D
shit.. concerning psionics optimization, lycan IS the book
[/spoiler]

ninjarabbit

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Re: It's Time To Duel
« Reply #53 on: April 18, 2011, 10:10:19 PM »
Monks are pretty fast and they have hide and move silently as class skills, an unsuspecting spellcasting are in a world of hurt when AMF'd monk just sneaks up on them. I just don't know how a spellcaster can defend against such a dastardly tactic.

Lycanthromancer

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Re: It's Time To Duel
« Reply #54 on: April 18, 2011, 10:31:21 PM »
Monks are pretty fast and they have hide and move silently as class skills, an unsuspecting spellcasting are in a world of hurt when AMF'd monk just sneaks up on them. I just don't know how a spellcaster can defend against such a dastardly tactic.
Uh...Tinfoil hat? It's an auto-fix. He doesn't need to know the monk's there.
[spoiler]Masculine men like masculine things. Masculine men are masculine. Therefore, liking masculine men is masculine.

I dare anyone to find a hole in that logic.
______________________________________
[/spoiler]I'm a writer. These are my stories. Some are even SFW! (Warning: Mostly Gay.)
My awesome poster collection. (Warning, some are NSFW.)
Agita's awesome poster collection.
[spoiler]
+1 Lycanthromancer
Which book is Lycanthromancer in?
Lyca ... is in the book. Yes he is.
 :D
shit.. concerning psionics optimization, lycan IS the book
[/spoiler]

X-Codes

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Re: It's Time To Duel
« Reply #55 on: April 18, 2011, 11:14:50 PM »
Monks are pretty fast and they have hide and move silently as class skills, an unsuspecting spellcasting are in a world of hurt when AMF'd monk just sneaks up on them. I just don't know how a spellcaster can defend against such a dastardly tactic.
Uh...Tinfoil hat? It's an auto-fix. He doesn't need to know the monk's there.
I think your sarcasm detector needs new batteries.  That was Ninjarabbit you were replying to. :p

ninjarabbit

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Re: It's Time To Duel
« Reply #56 on: April 18, 2011, 11:15:57 PM »
What is a monk? A miserable little pile of secrets! But enough talk...have at you!

Lycanthromancer

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Re: It's Time To Duel
« Reply #57 on: April 18, 2011, 11:25:58 PM »
Monks are pretty fast and they have hide and move silently as class skills, an unsuspecting spellcasting are in a world of hurt when AMF'd monk just sneaks up on them. I just don't know how a spellcaster can defend against such a dastardly tactic.
Uh...Tinfoil hat? It's an auto-fix. He doesn't need to know the monk's there.
I think your sarcasm detector needs new batteries.  That was Ninjarabbit you were replying to. :p
D'oh! I confused him for Giacomo for a minute.

Must be the monk-esque ninja skills. Only one's a swordsage and the other is an actual monk.
[spoiler]Masculine men like masculine things. Masculine men are masculine. Therefore, liking masculine men is masculine.

I dare anyone to find a hole in that logic.
______________________________________
[/spoiler]I'm a writer. These are my stories. Some are even SFW! (Warning: Mostly Gay.)
My awesome poster collection. (Warning, some are NSFW.)
Agita's awesome poster collection.
[spoiler]
+1 Lycanthromancer
Which book is Lycanthromancer in?
Lyca ... is in the book. Yes he is.
 :D
shit.. concerning psionics optimization, lycan IS the book
[/spoiler]

ninjarabbit

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Re: It's Time To Duel
« Reply #58 on: April 18, 2011, 11:40:46 PM »
Sucessful disguise and bluff check, neither of which are monk class skills. But that never stopped a monk from UMDing.
« Last Edit: April 18, 2011, 11:44:16 PM by ninjarabbit »

Lycanthromancer

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Re: It's Time To Duel
« Reply #59 on: April 18, 2011, 11:46:51 PM »
Sucessful disguise and bluff check, neither of which are monk class skills. But that never stopped a monk from UMDing.
Silent and deadly...like a ninja.

Or flatulence.

One of these things applies only to ninjarabbit.
[spoiler]Masculine men like masculine things. Masculine men are masculine. Therefore, liking masculine men is masculine.

I dare anyone to find a hole in that logic.
______________________________________
[/spoiler]I'm a writer. These are my stories. Some are even SFW! (Warning: Mostly Gay.)
My awesome poster collection. (Warning, some are NSFW.)
Agita's awesome poster collection.
[spoiler]
+1 Lycanthromancer
Which book is Lycanthromancer in?
Lyca ... is in the book. Yes he is.
 :D
shit.. concerning psionics optimization, lycan IS the book
[/spoiler]