Author Topic: Natural Weapons and You: A Mini-Guide  (Read 124306 times)

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Echoes

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Re: Natural Weapons and You: A Mini-Guide
« Reply #20 on: March 08, 2011, 09:29:06 AM »
The Thayan Gladiator PrC from Champions of Ruin needs a mention at some point. It can potentially triple the number of natural attacks you can make (if all of your attacks are of the same type, i.e. claw, bite, tentacle, etc), along with other sexy bonuses.

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AtomicKitKat

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Re: Natural Weapons and You: A Mini-Guide
« Reply #21 on: March 09, 2011, 02:46:29 PM »
I might be misremembering, but Thrall of Baphomet from an issue of Dragon granted either a Bite or a Gore(if you had one, it gave you the other). If you had both, both went up a size category in damage. :love

Also from Champions of Ruin, Thrall of Eltab(I think?) granted a Gore attack(too bad you can't be a Thrall to both). As far as how to get both a Bite and a Gore, probably Feral Minotaur. Lowest effective level I can think of to acquire both forms of attack is probably some kind of Feral Half-Satyr(or Half-Minotaur). For an option which won't have the DM slicing you with his DM screen, probably Geomancer.

Bigtuna

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Re: Natural Weapons and You: A Mini-Guide
« Reply #22 on: March 11, 2011, 01:11:42 AM »
The feat Dragon touched - from dragon magic, gives you the dragon subtype - that should be enough for rapid strike or? - if not i quess you need a template.
And rapid strike and imp. rapid strike- well if you have a lot of the same natural weapon them is nice..


Echoes

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Re: Natural Weapons and You: A Mini-Guide
« Reply #23 on: March 11, 2011, 05:14:17 AM »
The feat Dragon touched - from dragon magic, gives you the dragon subtype - that should be enough for rapid strike or? - if not i quess you need a template.
And rapid strike and imp. rapid strike- well if you have a lot of the same natural weapon them is nice..



Dragontouched gives the dragonblood subtype, which is entirely different from being a dragon. All that lets you do is use magic items that require you to be a dragon, as well as access dragonblood-specific effects.

Now, being a dragon automatically qualifies you for anything that requires the dragonblood subtype (which has hilarious side effects like qualifying for some PrCs out of the box), but it doesn't work the other way.
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Quotes I Found Entertaining:

Huge amounts of people are fuckwits. That doesn't mean that fuckwit is a valid lifestyle.

As a general rule, murdering people and taking their stuff is pretty much superior to breaking their stuff, murdering them, then not having any stuff to take.

Out of Context Theater
[spoiler]
Oh I'll make a party. I'll make a party so hard... I'll make a party that makes you feel so awkward downstairs.

You'll see the party and only be able to respond, "Oh yeah baby."
[/spoiler]

Bigtuna

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Re: Natural Weapons and You: A Mini-Guide
« Reply #24 on: March 11, 2011, 12:11:49 PM »
Thanks - I don't get the whole subtype/dragonblooded thing. So The Dragonborn template from RoD won't work either...


awaken DM golem

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Re: Natural Weapons and You: A Mini-Guide
« Reply #25 on: March 13, 2011, 09:54:26 PM »

(Tri-Kreen)
ECL 1/Monterous humanoid 2 ... Ardent1/Totemist 2/Warmind 10/+4 X


The CPsi monster class for Thrikreen works here.

Not sure what you mean by "ECL 1".
In any case, the normal 2hd racial + 2LA = 4 levels;
and then LA buy-off takes care of the +2LA by level 20.
Opens up another level.

Warmind 5 is usually enough.
The Psi and MoI double class works, and on the Ardent side
without further help because of the 2nd level Warmind festing.

Thrikreen 2 / Ardent 1 / Totemist 2 / Warmind 5 / DualX 10
... gets to the 9s with some more CO-ing.

Bigtuna

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Re: Natural Weapons and You: A Mini-Guide
« Reply #26 on: March 17, 2011, 02:41:06 PM »
ECL - my way of writing LA +1.

The Tri-Kreen from Shining South has either LA +1 or LA +2 - i choose the one with only +1 loose a few psi-like abilities - but better than loosing a level to LA. (this could be controversial i just realise, some master might not let you do this)
If LA is allowed (it never is for poor me) this just makes more room for more fun.

Can't seem to find the Duel class - where is it from?

AtomicKitKat

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Re: Natural Weapons and You: A Mini-Guide
« Reply #27 on: March 17, 2011, 05:42:08 PM »
ECL - my way of writing LA +1.

The Tri-Kreen from Shining South has either LA +1 or LA +2 - i choose the one with only +1 loose a few psi-like abilities - but better than loosing a level to LA. (this could be controversial i just realise, some master might not let you do this)
If LA is allowed (it never is for poor me) this just makes more room for more fun.

Can't seem to find the Duel class - where is it from?

Can be confusing if you use one term but mean the other.

If you meant the Duelist, I think it's in Complete Warrior or Complete Adventurer.

Solo

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Re: Natural Weapons and You: A Mini-Guide
« Reply #28 on: March 17, 2011, 07:49:50 PM »
Duelist? That's a core prestige class.

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The Legend RPG, which I worked on and encourage you to read.

snakeman830

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Re: Natural Weapons and You: A Mini-Guide
« Reply #29 on: March 17, 2011, 08:30:20 PM »
Necklace of Natural Attacks (SS) can apply to as many weapons as you want it to.  You just need to pay for each weapon it affects.
I am constantly amazed by how many DM's ban Tomb of Battle.  The book doesn't even exist!

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Bigtuna

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Re: Natural Weapons and You: A Mini-Guide
« Reply #30 on: March 17, 2011, 10:24:04 PM »
"Duelist" - no i think he is refering to  a class that advances both manifester and soulbinder.

And sorry for the confusion about LA and ECL.. I just copied from a doc, and didn't quite made it sense  :-)


Echoes

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Re: Natural Weapons and You: A Mini-Guide
« Reply #31 on: March 18, 2011, 03:57:19 AM »
"Duelist" - no i think he is refering to  a class that advances both manifester and soulbinder.

And sorry for the confusion about LA and ECL.. I just copied from a doc, and didn't quite made it sense  :-)



That would be the Soul Manifester from the Mind's Eye column.
BrokeAndDrive speaks the Truth (linked for great justice and signature limits)

Quotes I Found Entertaining:

Huge amounts of people are fuckwits. That doesn't mean that fuckwit is a valid lifestyle.

As a general rule, murdering people and taking their stuff is pretty much superior to breaking their stuff, murdering them, then not having any stuff to take.

Out of Context Theater
[spoiler]
Oh I'll make a party. I'll make a party so hard... I'll make a party that makes you feel so awkward downstairs.

You'll see the party and only be able to respond, "Oh yeah baby."
[/spoiler]

Midnight_v

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Re: Natural Weapons and You: A Mini-Guide
« Reply #32 on: March 18, 2011, 10:10:41 AM »
SOLO!  :lol
You're guide are epic, and they're getting better and better. Bravo.
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nijineko

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Re: Natural Weapons and You: A Mini-Guide
« Reply #33 on: March 24, 2011, 06:25:15 AM »
Very useful guide, thank you very much. ^^
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DrPhro

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Re: Natural Weapons and You: A Mini-Guide
« Reply #34 on: April 22, 2011, 04:06:30 PM »
Thank you for this guide! I have to say that I love natural attacks because the stacking potential can lead to disgusting amounts of damage. My favorite char by far was a feral shifter. Warshaper and Weretouched Master are both easy entries (i guess the later makes it necessary) and both give a size increase at lvl 1! combine that with a braid of dire shifting (RoE) and Improved Natural Attack and suddenly those 1d8 claws become 6d6 claws  :love. It should also be noted that Black Blood Cultist (CoR) gets claws, a bite, and a size increase to both, though I'm not sure if it stacks with others.

Oh and this is my first post so... Hi  :p

mickeymacttack

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Re: Natural Weapons and You: A Mini-Guide
« Reply #35 on: April 26, 2011, 05:01:41 AM »
One question regarding this (sorry if this was posted already as I may have missed it).  How do natural attacks work with a monks unarmed strikes?  For instance say I have a level 1 monk with 2 claw attacks and a bite attack, if I make a full attack can I hit with my unarmed strike as my primary and my claws and bite as secondary?

I ask this because it specifically states in the monk section that a monk can make an unarmed attack with any part of her body, as such she is freely capable of making attacks while her hands are full.

nijineko

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Re: Natural Weapons and You: A Mini-Guide
« Reply #36 on: April 26, 2011, 06:30:27 AM »
natural attack routines are not normally compatible with monk flurries. you can, however, use one natural attack as an off-hand attack at the usual penalties if you take certain options. some options allow for more. iirc. the FAQ has sections on this.
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mickeymacttack

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Re: Natural Weapons and You: A Mini-Guide
« Reply #37 on: April 26, 2011, 09:35:10 AM »
natural attack routines are not normally compatible with monk flurries. you can, however, use one natural attack as an off-hand attack at the usual penalties if you take certain options. some options allow for more. iirc. the FAQ has sections on this.

I read the FAQ but it doesn't actually answer the question asked, the main question asked regarding this was "Can a monk who has natural weapon attacks (such as a
centaur monk) attack unarmed and still use his natural weapons?"

Wizards went on to include an example but used flurry, my question is can a monk make a full round attack and use natural weapons as secondary attacks?  In other words as a 1st level monk with 2 claw attacks and a bite attack, on a full attack could I attack with UAS+claw1+claw2+bite or would I have to pick my UAS over my claws and bite?  I know you cant use flurry with another other than monk weapons, it specifically states this in the PHB.

The problem is it states that monks UAS count as both manufactured and natural weapons, well the rules of natural weapons are that you can have a primary and secondary attack with them, so by that logic and by the wording in unarmed strike for the monk I should be able to use my UAS as my primary natural attack and my claws and bite as secondaries.

Does that make sense?

Solo

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Re: Natural Weapons and You: A Mini-Guide
« Reply #38 on: April 26, 2011, 09:54:50 AM »
Quote
A monk’s unarmed strike is treated both as a manufactured weapon and a natural weapon for the purpose of spells and effects that enhance or improve either manufactured weapons or natural weapons.
This mean that they count as natural weapons when you're using iterative attacks.

"I am the Black Mage! I cast the spells that makes the peoples fall down!"

The Legend RPG, which I worked on and encourage you to read.

Bigtuna

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Re: Natural Weapons and You: A Mini-Guide
« Reply #39 on: April 26, 2011, 10:06:46 AM »
I think by RAW the answer is YES. You can attack with a monks unarmed strike + natural attacks (se link below). Gaining ekstra attacks from high BAB on UAS.
You can either make the UAS with a primary limp (means you get a claw attack less), but doing full str dam OR count it as a secondary attack in which case you get to use you claws as primary attacks (full bab/full str dam), bite/UAS as secondary -5, and only ½ str dam.

Personally i wouldn't allow Confu Bears as a GM...  

Also: "monk cannot use a flurry when using anything other than an unarmed strike or a special monk weapon. A nonmonk weapon or a natural weapon can't be combined with a flurry in any way."


But see: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/rg/20070403a


« Last Edit: April 26, 2011, 10:08:26 AM by Bigtuna »