Author Topic: Monk's Handbook  (Read 251579 times)

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gorfnad

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Re: Monk's Handbook
« Reply #180 on: March 03, 2010, 08:23:05 AM »
I don't know if this has been posted in the previous pages but Bard 6/ Monk 2/ Enlightened Fist 2/ Sublime Chord 2/ Enlightened Fist 8 might work. It gets 9th level spells and combines nicely with Devoted Performer and Ascetic Mage.

Solo

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Re: Monk's Handbook
« Reply #181 on: March 03, 2010, 08:54:33 AM »
Intriguing. Can you stat that out for us in greater detail, and come up with a catchy name for it? It's kinda like the arcane version of the Sacreligious Fist... hm...

Though I'd go Enlightened Fist 1/SC2/Enlightened 4 and move on to something else with full caster level advancement. Abjurant Champion, perhaps?

Of course, this means that Swift Abjuration will only be able to be used on bard spells. Don't know if bards get any good abjurations in core or the splatbooks. I know they have Dispel Magic, though...
« Last Edit: March 03, 2010, 09:04:12 AM by Solo »

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bearsarebrown

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Re: Monk's Handbook
« Reply #182 on: March 03, 2010, 09:43:56 PM »
Of course, this means that Swift Abjuration will only be able to be used on bard spells.
Whys that? Use it on the Sublime Chord spells....

Solo

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Re: Monk's Handbook
« Reply #183 on: March 03, 2010, 10:35:04 PM »
You can't use it on spells that are higher than third level.

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The Legend RPG, which I worked on and encourage you to read.

bearsarebrown

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Re: Monk's Handbook
« Reply #184 on: March 03, 2010, 10:48:06 PM »
Oh my!  :rollseyes I'm an idiot.   :embarrassed

Sinfire Titan

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Re: Monk's Handbook
« Reply #185 on: March 04, 2010, 10:18:18 PM »
Hey Dman!
Quote from: Dragonmark Fist
Prerequisites: Improved Unarmed Strike, any true
or aberrant dragonmark.
Benefit: You can spend 1 action point to automatically
deal maximum damage with an unarmed strike. The
decision to spend the action point is made after the attack
is resolved but before damage is rolled.


Feat from Dragomarked. How's that for stupid (both ways)?


[spoiler][/spoiler]

bearsarebrown

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Re: Monk's Handbook
« Reply #186 on: March 04, 2010, 10:21:39 PM »
Feat from Dragomarked. How's that for stupid (both ways)?

When you have silly base damage like 24d8 that'd be strong. If it didn't cost a fucking Action Point.

Sinfire Titan

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Re: Monk's Handbook
« Reply #187 on: March 04, 2010, 10:30:09 PM »
Feat from Dragomarked. How's that for stupid (both ways)?

When you have silly base damage like 24d8 that'd be strong. If it didn't cost a fucking Action Point.

Wands of Heroics=X Action Points/use of the wand. There's a Fighter feat in an Eberron Splatbook that grants temporary action points.


[spoiler][/spoiler]

Catty Nebulart

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Re: Monk's Handbook
« Reply #188 on: June 08, 2010, 08:55:34 AM »
Ladies and gentlebeings, may I present to you the 'Feral War Monk'  :love  :clap

I still remember it as if it was yesterday, the unassuming looking young girl clad in dirty rags as if she had gone twenty levels without buying new clothes stepped out of the woods right into the path of them giants, told them to go back to the mountains and leave the village alone she did. The giants just laughed and one of them tried to stomp on her, when in the blink of an eye she towered over them, fists reshapen into over sized claws, even on her huge frame, tearing giants apart two or three at a time with huge sweeping strikes almost too quick for the eye to follow. As the giants turned to flee her limbs stretched in unnatural ways, denying them any hope of escape. Then she just left back into the woods whence she came, leaving a mound of corpses behind. We buried them as best we could and that is why that hill is called the giant mound.
- a tailor recounting a low CR encounter.

The Feral War Monk lives in the great forest, occasionally visited by less experienced monks who seek her wisdom or instruction in her sublime fighting style, but few can keep up with her demanding training, said to be as merciless as mother nature herself. It is said that it is the most lethal school of martial arts ever developed, and each prospective pupil must add to it before being taught by brining the knowledge of the anatomy and weaknesses of a creature to the style.
it is said the only reason she leaves the forest is to test the new techniques against the most dangerous creatures she can find. Wether these rumors are true or not only a few elder monks that have trained under her and survived know.

The Feral War Monk is not notable for it being hyper-optimized, but it is hyper-self sufficient, has a lot of endurance, and it is notable for having just one magic item. That's right just one, so there is plenty of room to optimize this build, even by just tweaking the equipment list a bit. Or you can ask the 20'th level wizard if he can spare a 1'st and 3'rd level slot for mage armour and greater magic weapon, giving a significant boost to your capabilities. If he is any decent as a God he can do far better in day long buffs, but even the most selfish should be able to manage that.

This build makes an excellent big stupid fighter, being big and able to take staggering amounts of damage. note the low will save though. The build should be decent from level 7 and be interesting from level 9 on. before that you are just a monk and not a very good one. By 12'th level you should be well on your way to becoming a monster. :P :lol

Also boots to knowledge skills up your attack bonus and damage,so getting a knowledge skill boost would be nice.

6 Monk(PHB), 4 Warshaper(Complete Warrior), 9 Warmind, 1 Fist of the Forrest (Complete Champion)

32 point buy:
wis:15
dex, str, int,con: 14
cha:8

Race: Changeling (Eberron)
6 Monk
2 Warshaper
1 Warmind
2 Warshaper
3 Warmind
1 Fist of the Forest
5 Warmind

bab/saves: 17/17/14/9
Powers: manifester level 13, pp: 116
1: Expansion
1: Elfsight (you could take something better but this has the best utility I could find)
2: Hustle
3: Claws of the Vampire
4: Dimension Door

Greater Flurry (two extra attack at max bonus) and sweeping strike (attack all in two adjacent hexes) for a total of up to 12 attacks per full attack.
ac; wis + con + 3 AC bonus
DR; 3/-, fast healing 2, some neat immunities
60 ft base move, 5'ft extra reach
damage is a mere 3d8 base +10 str + 1 insight before expansion which boosts it to 6d6 or 9d6 if you expand two size categories. Which you can do as a swift action (13 pp, or 9pp to do it as a standard action and keep it up for 2 hours). This is not much for a monk but still respectable. With some items and spells you could significantly increase the damage.

92 skillpoints
38: requirements; crossclass 8 on handle animal, survival, 4 on know History, classskills; 8 on know psionics, 5 on autohypnosis, 5 on concentrate
8 for 2 each on know Dungoneering, Nature, planes, local,
40 for 5 tumble, move silently, hide, psycraft, spot, listen, knowledge(Arcana, religion)
1 each on swim and disguise
4 spent on languages for a total of 7 languages spoken

feats:
1: Knowledge Devotion (psionics)
1B: Stunning Fist
2B: Combat Reflexes
3; Wild Talent
6B: Monastic Training
6: Power Attack
9: Practiced Manifester
12: Thaselora
15: Great Fortitude
18: Up the walls

level 20:
200000 equipment belt of magnificence +6
137500 for inherent +5 to wis
137500 for inherent +5 to con
137500 for inherent +5 to str
137500 for inherent +5 to dex

10k left

stats with items
str: 30(+10) = 14 base + 6 enhacement + 5 inherent + 4 warshaper + level
dex: 26(+ 8) = 14 base + 6 enhacement + 5 inherent + 1 level
con: 30(+10) = 14 base + 6 enhacement + 5 inherent + 4 warshaper + 1 level
int: 20(+ 5) = 14 base + 6 enhacement
wis: 28(+ 9) = 15 base + 6 enhacement + 5 inherent + 2 level
cha; 14(+ 2) =  8 base + 6 enhacement

AC:   40 = 10 base + 8 dex + 9 wis + 10 con + 3 monk (not counting the temp +2 from chain of superiority and +4 of chain of defense, yup up to 46 AC without any of the normal bonuses, like say armour, or bracers of.)
fort: 27 = 17 base + 10 con
ref:  22 = 14 base +  8 dex
will: 18 =  9 base +  9 wis
Attack bonus: 17 bab + 10 str + 1 insight = +28 (+2 from chain of superiority)
E: "Did they... did they just endorse the combination of the JSDF and US Army by showing them as two lesbian lolicons moving in together and holding hands and talking about how 'intimate' they were?"
B: "Have you forgotten so soon? They're phasing out Don't Ask, Don't Tell."

Solo

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Re: Monk's Handbook
« Reply #189 on: June 08, 2010, 02:58:24 PM »
Wands of Heroics=X Action Points/use of the wand. There's a Fighter feat in an Eberron Splatbook that grants temporary action points.
And we all know how good monks are at using wands.

"I am the Black Mage! I cast the spells that makes the peoples fall down!"

The Legend RPG, which I worked on and encourage you to read.

Solo

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Re: Monk's Handbook
« Reply #190 on: June 08, 2010, 03:02:21 PM »
fort: 27 = 17 base + 10 con
ref:  22 = 14 base +  8 dex
will: 18 =  9 base +  9 wis
Attack bonus: 17 bab + 10 str + 1 insight = +28 (+2 from chain of superiority)
Will and AB are too low.

Why no Amulet of Natural Attacks?

Hm.

Barbarian 4/Fist of the Forest3/Bear Warrior 1/Warshaper5/Something Interesting 7 would probably work better.

"I am the Black Mage! I cast the spells that makes the peoples fall down!"

The Legend RPG, which I worked on and encourage you to read.

carnivore

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Re: Monk's Handbook
« Reply #191 on: June 08, 2010, 06:29:22 PM »
i would recomend this instead:

4 Monk(PHB), 3 Warshaper(Complete Warrior), 10 Warmind, 3 Fist of the Forrest

since Fist of the Forest gives boosts to the Size of the Die for Unarmed Damage.... might as well get as much as you can... also go Warmind 10 to get 5th lvl Power

 :D

Solo

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Re: Monk's Handbook
« Reply #192 on: June 08, 2010, 09:45:58 PM »
How are you qualifying for Warshaper at level 4?

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snakeman830

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Re: Monk's Handbook
« Reply #193 on: June 08, 2010, 10:45:29 PM »
Changeling?
I am constantly amazed by how many DM's ban Tomb of Battle.  The book doesn't even exist!

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Jopustopin

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Re: Monk's Handbook
« Reply #194 on: June 08, 2010, 11:26:44 PM »
Changeling?

There are two pre-req's for warshaper.  One is satisfied by being a changeling.  The other requires a +4 BAB so to qualify at level 4 you would need a full BAB.

Catty Nebulart

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Re: Monk's Handbook
« Reply #195 on: June 09, 2010, 12:13:35 AM »
Will and AB are too low.

Why no Amulet of Natural Attacks?

I agree they are too low, but note that this build lacks almost all the normal bonuses to such things. Instead of the book of dex and the belt of everything you would be better of boosting the 3 important stats and grabing bracers of armor, a cloak of resistance and other misc bonus granting items. But few other classes can do as well when restricted to one magic item.

I mostly didn't want to spend time thinking about what items to take, but being loaded down with magical gear like most characters are also doesn't really fit the image of this kind of monk. If it is a PC the wizard should be able to spare 1 casting of greater magic weapon, mage armor, and some spell that grants a +5 resistance bonus to all saves (the only save boosting spell I can think of is the 0'th level resistance, but I'm sure there is some CL/4 1/CL hour resistance boosting save spell. probably never used because cloaks of resistance do it better). That suddenly makes those numbers a lot more reasonable, most characters of that level already have all those easy to get bonuses. also remember the situational bonuses to will saves (Changeling bonus and monk bonus, possibly others).

Or you know the PC could use the monk guide to find reasonable equipment.

If it's an npc the party has less to loot.
E: "Did they... did they just endorse the combination of the JSDF and US Army by showing them as two lesbian lolicons moving in together and holding hands and talking about how 'intimate' they were?"
B: "Have you forgotten so soon? They're phasing out Don't Ask, Don't Tell."

Solo

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Re: Monk's Handbook
« Reply #196 on: June 09, 2010, 12:15:40 AM »
I agree they are too low, but note that this build lacks almost all the normal bonuses to such things. Instead of the book of dex and the belt of everything you would be better of boosting the 3 important stats and grabing bracers of armor, a cloak of resistance and other misc bonus granting items. But few other classes can do as well when restricted to one magic item.
Druid. Cleric. Sorcerer. Wizard. Beguiler.

"I am the Black Mage! I cast the spells that makes the peoples fall down!"

The Legend RPG, which I worked on and encourage you to read.

Catty Nebulart

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Re: Monk's Handbook
« Reply #197 on: June 09, 2010, 02:19:48 AM »
Druid. Cleric. Sorcerer. Wizard. Beguiler.

The psionic classes would generally do it better, but the basic breakdown of the classes than can do well with no or just one item is as follows:
1) primary caster: Tier 1 or 2, no longer held back by items that are far weaker than them. Endurance is the main thing that suffers, but with timestop and planar travel not really.
2) Soulknife; (also includes pyrokinetisits etc) you make your own equipment so lack of equipment lets you shine for a change, since WotC love to hose those who make their own stuff.
3) Psychic Warrior; esspecially the Claw of ... focused. Any sufficiently self buffing gish goes here.
4) the monk: hey everybody is unarmed or unarmored. I suddenly rock.
5) Forsaker (also includes vow of poverty, etc): hey everyone else has your drawbacks, and they don't have your marginal benefits.

Everyone else is hosed. Which is nothing new. though i will admit one I spend a bit of time thinking about it i was surprised at how long the list is. I guess I have played too many monks that are over-relaint on equipment. :banghead

If you actually wanted to optimize this build you would drop the 4'th level of warshaper and instead aquire the feral template from savage species. it gives better fast healing, some neat abilities and a mild boost to important stats. the int penalty is unfortunate, but savage species also includes rituals to aquire templates, so for the price of some gold you can keep most of your skillpoints, which is almost the only reason you care about int. (knowledge devotion is the other but I'm sure there are some good ways to boost knowledge checks that do not rely on high int score).

As for altering the build level 9 of warmind gives too much neat stuff to give up in my mind, manifester level 13 mean you can expand 2 size categories as a swift action, or dimension door as a move action, also energy adaptation and many other powers that you could take tend to give a nice bonus at ML 11 or 13. In contrast warmind 10 is an almost useless level except for 5'th level powers.
E: "Did they... did they just endorse the combination of the JSDF and US Army by showing them as two lesbian lolicons moving in together and holding hands and talking about how 'intimate' they were?"
B: "Have you forgotten so soon? They're phasing out Don't Ask, Don't Tell."

carnivore

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Re: Monk's Handbook
« Reply #198 on: June 09, 2010, 05:45:57 PM »
using the same Point buy ... and equipment and Skills and Attribute set.... heres what i would do:

Changeling
5 Monk(Overwhelming Attack variant)/ 2 Warshaper/ 10 Warmind/3 Fist of the Forrest

Attributes:
30 Str(base 14 +1 lvl +5 Inherent +6 belt +4 Warshaper)
25 Dex(base 14 +5 Inherent +6 belt)
30 Con(base 14 +1 lvl +5 Inherent +6 belt +4 Warshaper)
18 Int(base 12 +6 belt)
30 Wis(base 16 +3 lvl +5 Inherent +6 belt)
14 Cha(base 8 +6 belt)

Feats:
Improved Unarmed Strike(Monk bonus)
Power Attack(Monk Bonus)
Monastic Training(Warmind)(Monk Bonus)
1st lvl: Knowledge Devotion(Knowledge(Psionics))
3rd lvl: Wild Talent
6th lvl: Great Fortitude
9th lvl: Practiced Manifester
12th lvl: Tashalatora(Warmind)  
15th lvl: Improved Natural Attack(Unarmed Strike) .......... or Link Power
18th lvl: Expanded Knowledge(Metamorphosis)


Progression:

Monk 1
Monk 2
Monk 3
Monk 4
Monk 5
Warmind 1
Warshaper 1
Warshaper 2
Warmind 2
Warmind 3
Warmind 4
Warmind 5
Warmind 6
Warmind 7
Warmind 8
Warmind 9
Warmind 10
Fist of the Forest 1
Fist of the Forest 2
Fist of the Forest 3

BAB +17
Damage = (2d6 = 15th lvl Monk)+ 2 size increases on Monk progression Table = 2d10 from Fist of the Forest) + 1 die increase from Warshaper = 4d8)+ 1 additional Die increase (Imp Natural Attack)= Base 6d8 .... can be boosted farther with Expansion


Manifester Level = 14th lvl, PP 133
Powers Known:
1st lvl:
Expansion
Inertial Armor

2nd lvl:
Hustle or Dimension Slide

3rd lvl:
Claws of the Vampire

4th lvl:
Metamorphosis
Energy Adaptation

5th lvl:
Oak Body


does more damage... can get a better AC, more combat options ... you only lose 7 skill points

 :D
« Last Edit: June 09, 2010, 05:52:19 PM by carnivore »

snakeman830

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Re: Monk's Handbook
« Reply #199 on: June 09, 2010, 06:03:22 PM »
Umm, Monk 4 and Monk 5 have the same BAB.  You still don't qualify for Warshaper by level 6.
I am constantly amazed by how many DM's ban Tomb of Battle.  The book doesn't even exist!

Quotes:[spoiler]
By yes, she means no.
That explains so much about my life.
hiicantcomeupwithacharacterthatisntaghostwhyisthatamijustretardedorsomething
Why would you even do this? It hurts my eyes and looks like you ate your keyboard before suffering an attack of explosive diarrhea.
[/spoiler]

If using Genesis to hide your phylactry, set it at -300 degrees farenheit.  See how do-gooders fare with a liquid atmosphere.