Author Topic: New Special Ability: Arcane Defiance  (Read 2999 times)

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Necrosnoop110

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New Special Ability: Arcane Defiance
« on: November 12, 2010, 02:01:24 AM »
In light of the thread What is the point of Spell Resistance (SR)? I've been kicking around an idea for a new mechanic, not as a blanket replacement for SR but as a carefully selected and placed alternative to SR. Feedback welcome.

ARCANE DEFIANCE
Arcane defiance is the extraordinary ability to avoid being effected by and possibly disrupting spells or spell-like effects. Successfully ignoring a spell or spell-like effect does not interrupt the effect if the effect has no saving throw; if a successfully ignored spell or spell-like effect allows for a saving throw and if that creature makes both the arcane defiance roll and the saving throw for that spell or spell-like effect it is disrupted. An arcane defiance roll can be made whenever a creature with arcane defiance comes into contact with a spell or spell-like effect, even if the creature is unaware that it is doing so. All damage, energy, physical, force, mental influence or all other magical phenomena simply roll off the creatures back like water off a duck. All spell or spell-like effects successfully ignored using arcane defiance are stopped short and cannot make direct contact with the protected creature and can be freely ignored or passed through as if they did not exist. The protected creature can selectively allow spell or spell-like effects to effect it as the creature sees fit.  

Lesser Arcane Defiance (Ex): A creature with lesser arcane defiance has a 20% chance to ignore any spell or spell-like effect. If that same spell or spell-like effect grants a saving throw and both the arcane defiance and saving throw are made successfully the effect is disrupted.  

Arcane Defiance (Ex): A creature with arcane defiance has a 40% chance to ignore any spell or spell-like effect.  If that same spell or spell-like effect grants a saving throw and both the arcane defiance and saving throw are made successfully the effect is disrupted.  

Greater Arcane Defiance (Ex): A creature with greater arcane defiance has a 80% chance to ignore any spell or spell-like effect.  If that same spell or spell-like effect grants a saving throw and both the arcane defiance and saving throw are made successfully the effect is disrupted.  


Peace,
Necro
« Last Edit: November 12, 2010, 02:16:12 AM by Necrosnoop110 »

SiggyDevil

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Re: New Special Ability: Arcane Defiance
« Reply #1 on: November 12, 2010, 03:47:25 AM »
I just figured.. give a bonus to saves vs. Magic. If more specific it could also apply to AC against spells (such as the Orb series).


Also, your method of flat out percentages is a throwback to AD&D and older. Alas just as with SR there will be countermeasures because that's how D&D works.

bkdubs123

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Re: New Special Ability: Arcane Defiance
« Reply #2 on: November 12, 2010, 06:36:29 AM »
Also, your method of flat out percentages is a throwback to AD&D and older. Alas just as with SR there will be countermeasures because that's how D&D works.

An example, please, of how what you're saying works?

If a spell ignores SR and has no save, Greater Arcane Defiance still has an 80% chance to negate the effect entirely. What spells could possibly ignore Arcane Defiance?

Necrosnoop110

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Re: New Special Ability: Arcane Defiance
« Reply #3 on: November 12, 2010, 09:55:45 AM »
I just figured.. give a bonus to saves vs. Magic. If more specific it could also apply to AC against spells (such as the Orb series).
How is a save bonus equivalent to ignoring with the potential to disrupt equivalent?

Also, your method of flat out percentages is a throwback to AD&D and older. Alas just as with SR there will be countermeasures because that's how D&D works.
For sure it is a throwback :)

Countermeasures? I don't follow.

Peace,
Necro
« Last Edit: November 12, 2010, 12:46:12 PM by Necrosnoop110 »

RobbyPants

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Re: New Special Ability: Arcane Defiance
« Reply #4 on: November 12, 2010, 10:14:54 AM »
So, these work on SR: No spells too?  That just doesn't make any sense.  The point of those is that by the time the effect hits the creature, it's not magical anymore.  If you don't like SR: No spells, it's better just to get rid of them.
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Necrosnoop110

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Re: New Special Ability: Arcane Defiance
« Reply #5 on: November 12, 2010, 12:44:08 PM »
An example, please, of how what you're saying works?

Arcane Defiance vs effect that grants Saving Throw: No
1) That creature fails his Arcane Defiance roll. The results of the spell or spell-like effect happen normally.  

OR

2) That creature makes his Arcane Defiance roll successfully. The result are that he can ignore the effects but like SR the rest of the spell is not effected. The spell still happens just not to that creature. Instantaneous effects happen around him but not to him. Any residual effects he can pass through as if they do not exist.



Arcane Defiance vs effect that grants Saving Throw: Yes  
1) That creature fails his Arcane Defiance roll. The results of the spell or spell-like effect happen normally. Saves as per normal.

OR
  
2) That creature makes his Arcane Defiance roll successfully and fails his save. The result are that he can ignore the effects but like SR the rest of the spell is not effected. The spell still happens just not to that creature. Instantaneous effects happen around him but not to him. Any residual effects he can pass through as if they do not exist.

OR

3) That creature makes his Arcane Defiance roll successfully and makes his save rolls. The spell or spell-like effect is disrupted. The creature becomes a "spell buster" of sorts.

If a spell ignores SR and has no save, Greater Arcane Defiance still has an 80% chance to negate the effect entirely. What spells could possibly ignore Arcane Defiance?
That's the idea.  :)
« Last Edit: November 12, 2010, 12:47:26 PM by Necrosnoop110 »

Necrosnoop110

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Re: New Special Ability: Arcane Defiance
« Reply #6 on: November 12, 2010, 12:45:51 PM »
So, these work on SR: No spells too?  That just doesn't make any sense.  The point of those is that by the time the effect hits the creature, it's not magical anymore.  If you don't like SR: No spells, it's better just to get rid of them.
I hear what you are saying. But keep in mind this isn't a replacement to SR but a new ability all together. 

RobbyPants

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Re: New Special Ability: Arcane Defiance
« Reply #7 on: November 12, 2010, 01:10:44 PM »
So, these work on SR: No spells too?  That just doesn't make any sense.  The point of those is that by the time the effect hits the creature, it's not magical anymore.  If you don't like SR: No spells, it's better just to get rid of them.
I hear what you are saying. But keep in mind this isn't a replacement to SR but a new ability all together.  
I guess that makes sense in that it's not a replacement, but I can't get the ability to make sense in my head from an in-game-world perspective.  Basically, this guy has a chance to undo non-magical things that were once summoned/created by magic.

Can he undo all the healing someone received by touching them? :p  :smirk

In all seriousness, this ability might be better represented by some type of innate Dispel Magic ability, perhaps coupled with SR or a save boost or something.  In this way, you can dispel existing effects, but it wouldn't work on stuff with an Instantaneous duration.  That's where the SR comes in.
My balancing 3.5 compendium
Elemental mage test game

Quotes
[spoiler]
Quote from: Cafiend
It is a shame stupidity isn't painful.
Quote from: StormKnight
Totally true.  Historians believe that most past civilizations would have endured for centuries longer if they had successfully determined Batman's alignment.
Quote from: Grand Theft Otto
Why are so many posts on the board the equivalent of " Dear Dr. Crotch, I keep punching myself in the crotch, and my groin hurts... what should I do? How can I make my groin stop hurting?"
Quote from: CryoSilver
I suggest carving "Don't be a dick" into him with a knife.  A dull, rusty knife.  A dull, rusty, bent, flaming knife.
Quote from: Seerow
Fluffy: It's over Steve! I've got the high ground!
Steve: You underestimate my power!
Fluffy: Don't try it, Steve!
Steve: *charges*
Fluffy: *three critical strikes*
Steve: ****
Quote from: claypigeons
I don't even stat out commoners. Commoner = corpse that just isn't a zombie. Yet.
Quote from: CryoSilver
When I think "Old Testament Boots of Peace" I think of a paladin curb-stomping an orc and screaming "Your death brings peace to this land!"
Quote from: Orville_Oaksong
Buy a small country. Or Pelor. Both are good investments.
[/spoiler]

altpersona

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Re: New Special Ability: Arcane Defiance
« Reply #8 on: November 12, 2010, 01:41:05 PM »
spellfire?
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SiggyDevil

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Re: New Special Ability: Arcane Defiance
« Reply #9 on: November 12, 2010, 03:17:42 PM »
I just made a new feat.

Negate Arcane Defiance
Arcane Defiance is ignored.

D&D is like this constantly, but my example was just a joke to prove a point.

Necrosnoop110

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Re: New Special Ability: Arcane Defiance
« Reply #10 on: November 12, 2010, 04:38:32 PM »
I just made a new feat.

Negate Arcane Defiance
Arcane Defiance is ignored.

D&D is like this constantly, but my example was just a joke to prove a point.
SiggyDevil you crazy diamond :lmao

« Last Edit: November 12, 2010, 05:34:41 PM by Necrosnoop110 »

bkdubs123

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Re: New Special Ability: Arcane Defiance
« Reply #11 on: November 12, 2010, 06:30:07 PM »
I just made a new feat.

Negate Arcane Defiance
Arcane Defiance is ignored.

D&D is like this constantly, but my example was just a joke to prove a point.

Okay, I wasn't sure if that was what you meant or not.

Bozwevial

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Re: New Special Ability: Arcane Defiance
« Reply #12 on: November 12, 2010, 06:39:02 PM »
I just made a new feat.

Negate Arcane Defiance
Arcane Defiance is ignored.

D&D is like this constantly, but my example was just a joke to prove a point.
And knowing WotC, soon you'd get...

Oh No You Didn't
Arcane Defiance works anyway. Nyeah.

SiggyDevil

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Re: New Special Ability: Arcane Defiance
« Reply #13 on: November 12, 2010, 08:10:49 PM »
And knowing WotC, soon you'd get...

Oh No You Didn't
Arcane Defiance works anyway. Nyeah.


Feat bloat!

Yes I Did
The feat Oh No You Didn't is ignored.
Oh, and Spell Resistance sucks balls. That's ignored too for good measure.
bleh

Bozwevial

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Re: New Special Ability: Arcane Defiance
« Reply #14 on: November 12, 2010, 08:12:24 PM »
And knowing WotC, soon you'd get...

Oh No You Didn't
Arcane Defiance works anyway. Nyeah.

Arcane Defiance Will Never Prevail
The feat Oh No You Didn't is ignored.
Oh, and Spell Resistance sucks balls. That's ignored too for good measure.
bleh

I Banged The Wizard's Mom
And she liked it, too. Arcane Defiance works normally again.

SiggyDevil

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Re: New Special Ability: Arcane Defiance
« Reply #15 on: November 12, 2010, 08:23:16 PM »
I Banged The Wizard's Mom
And she liked it, too. Arcane Defiance works normally again.

Spiteful Grognard DM Strikes Again
Characters using Arcane Defiance are immediately killed.
Out of spite.
Because grognards like maintaining wizardly status quo.

Bozwevial

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Re: New Special Ability: Arcane Defiance
« Reply #16 on: November 12, 2010, 08:25:25 PM »
Spiteful Grognard DM Strikes Again
Characters using Arcane Defiance are immediately killed.
Out of spite.
Because grognards like maintaining wizardly status quo.

Revoke Club Status
You use your position on the student council to revoke the gaming group's permission to use the library after school, forcing them to move back to the DM's damp and cramped basement.

SiggyDevil

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Re: New Special Ability: Arcane Defiance
« Reply #17 on: November 12, 2010, 09:42:55 PM »
Revoke Club Status
You use your position on the student council to revoke the gaming group's permission to use the library after school, forcing them to move back to the DM's damp and cramped basement.

Ah, high school. I felt sick every day after D&D nights in the DM's dank dog-hair and Marlboro-filled basement.